Aug. 20, 2026

The Dark Strangler, Every Landlady's Nightmare | Part 2: Earle Nelson | Portland, Oregon

The Dark Strangler, Every Landlady's Nightmare | Part 2: Earle Nelson | Portland, Oregon
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Picking up where we left off in Part 1, Earle Leonard Nelson — the man newspapers called the 'Dark Strangler,' the 'Gorilla Man,' and the 'Gorilla Killer' — unbeknownst to the public or authorities had left the Pacific Northwest and was heading east. Behind him: a trail of victims across California, Oregon, and Washington, including four in Portland alone. Ahead of him: a killing spree that would accelerate across the Midwest and Eastern United States before finally being brought to a halt in Winnipeg, Manitoba.

Part 2 follows Nelson to Iowa, Kansas City, Philadelphia, and Buffalo where he would continue his brutal crimes. His final ten days would become the most violent stretch of the entire spree — five women killed across Detroit, Chicago, and Winnipeg between June 1st and June 10th, 1927. It's Winnipeg where the trail finally catches up with him, thanks to a jeweler, a barber, and a citywide search of boardinghouses.

We follow Nelson's arrest, trial, and eventual execution — hanged on Friday, January 13th, 1928 at the Vaughan Street Jail, becoming the 13th person to hang there, after walking 13 steps to the gallows. His confirmed count of over twenty victims would stand as a horrifying record in America for nearly fifty years.

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Every single one of his victims fits the biblical definition

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of a quote unquote strange woman. Women running boarding houses

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or showing properties without the oversight of a man, whether

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they were unmarried or widowed, women who were basically just

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managing their own affairs, Like can you even imagine that audacity?

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The exact demographic he was hunting is the very same

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one the passage warns men to be fearful of. That's

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not scripture. It's a hit list with a theological alibi.

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Hi, Cassie, Hi, Caitlyn, Hi, creepy people. Oh hello, Hey,

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this is PNW Hanson Homicide to where we chat about

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true crime, the paranormal and.

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Lots of spooky stuff in the Pacific Northwest or the

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p and W. If you're nice, nice you forgot to

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say it last episode.

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Oh I know, I forget like it's honestly, it's far

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and feun in between when I actually remember of my

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own accord, It's okay, but you know, I try get it.

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They'll get the nasty when they get it exactly well,

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I'm you know what, They're gonna get it today, and

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they're going to get the long way to tarot reading.

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Because this is parts two and normally we do a

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taro reading in every episode of the show, but this

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particular topic has turned into decidedly a two part, two

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part series, so we are we save the tarot reading

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for today.

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Yeah, yep, so looking forward to that.

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Stick around little something to look forward too, or just.

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Skip right to it. Oh well, just listen to that.

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If all you're interested in is the tarot.

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That would be so interesting if people were like not

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interested in the actual like content of the case, they

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just wanted to hear us read the tarot.

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Yeah, but we read the tarot about technically about the topic,

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so like you're gonna have to know what's going on

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because we will reference exactly.

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Yeah.

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I feel like otherwise it doesn't really make sense. Yeah,

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but you know, do you.

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Unless you're just taking the readings for yourself. I mean

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you could do that too, Yeah yeah, whatever, you float

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your boat man, all right.

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So I'm going to jump in exactly where we.

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Left off to the Midwest.

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Yeah. I was gonna say, I am so proud of

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you for remembering.

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Thank you. It was only like ten minutes ago.

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I know for some people it's been week, but for us,

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it's only been a few minutes. But you know, we

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were known to be a little bit gold fishy.

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So I don't know. Patreon, maybe if you're nice, if

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you're good, if you're good for girls and boys, maybe

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we'll give you two parts at once. Oh you don't

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have to wait.

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Yeah, and there is a Patreon bonus for this episode too,

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So say.

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Good things could be in store, santable see if you're

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on the not on your nice list.

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Yeah, it's too late for Christmas in July, but you

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know it's still summer. Yeah, and as we pick this up,

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we are picking the story up right around Christmas time.

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So, and Christmas is in our hearts all year, don't

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you know?

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Exactly, just like Halloween two days before Christmas. Our not

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so lovely character here he garrotted. Forty one year old

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Almera Berrard of Council bluffs Iowa with a shirt in

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her own home.

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I don't know why I had a physical reaction to

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that word.

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You know, garat is not a pleasant one.

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My body like jumped. I didn't like it.

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No, you know, as it turns out, I don't think

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that anyone does yet again, and I'm not sure I'll

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ever quite grasp how this kept happening. Her death was

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presumed a suicide initially.

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What what?

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Yeah, Yeah, Yeah, it happens in a few of these cases.

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Though I will say of all of the cases where

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this does pop up, it's perhaps the most justified because

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this was due to her recent discharge from a psychiatric institution. However,

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obviously the sexual assault findings would dispel that misguided theory.

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So yeah, I was kind of thinking that last time.

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I forgot to ask, like, it doesn't that did they

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not examine the other bodies that they thought were suicides

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and find like sexual assault? Yeah? I mean, I think

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eventually whether it was theft or that the body was

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examined more closely and they realized there were signs of

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like a struggle or sexual assault. You know, those are

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kind of even back then one hundred you know, one

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hundred years ago as of recording, those things did tend

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to jump out, and it would sort of move them

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in their right direction in terms of the investigation. Thankfully,

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it seems, at least for this killer, a break for

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the holidays, likely for practical reasons alone, was due, though

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it wouldn't last for long. Two days after Christmas, Nelson

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murdered his youngest victim to date at the time, Bonnie

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Pace of Kansas City, Missouri, twenty three years old.

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Wow, that is quite young, yes, compared.

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Yeah, I mean compared to the majority of his victims,

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very very young. The following day, December twenty eighth, while

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still in Kansas City, Nelson marked another horrifying first. He

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killed Germania harpin twenty eight as well as her eight

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month old son, Oh my god, strangling him with a diaper.

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What.

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Yeah, I mean remember at this point in history, like

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you're using cloth diapers too, so you know, the visual

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is different than you know in twenty twenty six, but horrifying. Nonetheless,

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it's just so eerie because like a diaper, Yeah, I

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don't know, it like takes care of the baby, Like

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it's a symbol of like a baby, like it is

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to use that and it doesn't feeling it should be

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a weapon.

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Yeah yeah, I mean, well sometimes some babies do make

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it a weapon, right.

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But right what they're blasting into the diaper, Yeah, like

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that diaper you know, yeah, no, I totally get it,

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but yeah, I mean in this context, it's just very

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it is disturbing. I mean, it's disturbing because obviously it's

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an infant, but then just something about.

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That visual is so unsettling.

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Their bodies were discovered by mister Harpin, husband and father

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to the victims, respectively, when he returned home that evening

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from work.

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Robert is the.

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Only male and only true child victim in the confirmed

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victim list. And I think it was just about opportunity

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most likely.

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Yeah, he was just like in the way.

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Yeah, I mean, he just happened to be there. Still,

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it seems unnecessary to have killed him.

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Obviously, what the he're gonna do? He can't say anything.

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He's not a witness, he's not power to remember this,

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like cognitively, but obviously this is about what he wanted.

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It wasn't necessarily a killing that occurred for any disgusting

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obviously say this, but.

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The worst thought he was probably crying, Yeah, like the.

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Baby unclear like which of them died first. But yeah, no,

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I mean that was kind of the same thought that

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I had, Like you might do that because what you

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don't want is a crying baby potentially drawing attention. Yeah,

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very sad, I mean, and think about that. This is

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three days after Christmas and your wife and it didn't

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say anything else about there being other children in the home,

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So presumably your wife and your only child, your firstborn son,

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are murdered three days after Christmas. Like, I don't know

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how you go on to have anything resembling a normal

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life after that. Following this crime, Nelson went dormant for

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nearly four months exactly, though it's clear that in that

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time he had navigated further east, landing in Philadelphia, where

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he killed his next victim on April twenty seventh of

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nineteen twenty seven, fifty three year old Mary McConnell. He

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stole several pieces of her jewelry, attempting to pawn one

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of her gold watches before being turned away. Though it's

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not exactly clear why the proprietor, Mary ke decline the transaction.

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I'm not sure why she said no, I don't want it.

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That is interesting, Yeah, just an interesting aside. I guess

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maybe because he gives creepy vibes and she's like, this is.

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Clearly a woman's watch or whatever. It was like, yeah,

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I don't know, how did you get this? And maybe

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he couldn't come up with like a good answer.

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I mean, it would be interesting to know more and

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kind of pull it that thread, like did she immediately

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like report something to the authorities, And that's how it

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was determined that like, oh yeah, this is this is him?

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Or is this something that we only learned kind of

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in hindsight, I don't really I.

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Don't have.

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Like that detailed of information on Well, I'm disappointed in you.

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Well, it's just interesting to think about, like maybe it is.

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Yeah, And to be honest, like some of this, even

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if I had tried to kind of like pull at

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these like specific little threads at the case, it's like

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the case is already like one hundred years old, and

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there's certain information that it's just like if it doesn't

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already exist publicly somehow like there, it's unlikely that I

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would ever be able to get that information. You know, yeah,

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if it wasn't already reported in a newspaper or you know,

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if somebody hadn't already yeah, whatever the channel would be.

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It's just now that's kind of lost to time a

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little bit.

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Again.

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In Buffalo, New York, just about a month later, on

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May thirtieth, nineteen twenty seven, Nelson killed fifty three year

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old Jenny Randolph, from whom he had rented a room

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three days earlier under the alias Charles Harrison, her brother

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Gideon Gilley, had met him and described him as about

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thirty three years old with a stocky build, dark complexion,

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and black hair slicked straight back. Yeah, which, okay, I.

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Picture it greasy. That's why I will about me too.

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But to expand on that, and this is like kind

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of one of those moments of levity. Have you ever

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watched the show? I think you should leave. No, there

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is a whole bit that he does about you think

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this is slicked back, and he's talking about like I

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used to splic my hair back all the time. The

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whole bit is about like, oh, yeah, I used to

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be a real piece of shit, slick my hair back.

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And like all of the scenarios are just like so

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silly and kind of outlandish, and they're not all equal winners,

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but that one's a classic. It's a good one. Her

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body was discovered stuffed under a bed. This is Jenny Randolph.

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Fellow border Fred Merritt later positively identified Nelson as Charles Harrison. Ooh,

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there's a lot of people that like, even if they

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weren't directly a witness to the crime, they are witnesses

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that can testify to like this is the alias he used,

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and yes, I can positively identify like this is the

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same man.

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So yeah, because he's so distinct.

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I mean, honestly, yeah. No, and his aliases are not very.

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Clever, but they're better than Clark.

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I don't know.

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Maybe where.

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Nelson had previously seemed to be engaged in an escalating

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spree prior to the new year. His crimes in nineteen

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twenty seven were initially roughly thirty days apart, but good

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things never last. In Detroit, Michigan, on June first, he

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killed two victims for the second time, the bodies of

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fifty three year old boarding house manager Fannie May and

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border Marine Atrothe Her maiden name was Oswald. Probably should

219
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have just gone with that because the atrothe I'm probably

220
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butchering it, is what I'm saying. They were discovered by

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the building owner, Leonard Sink as he made the rounds

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to collect rent, which is just I feel like a

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lot more than he bargained for. But two women.

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Mm hm, oh my gosh. Yeah.

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May was grotted with an electrical cord cut from a

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table lamp while the current was still live.

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Holy Jesus, did he get electrocuted.

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I mean one would hope, right, Like we should all

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be so lucky.

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How does electricity work.

231
00:15:11.600 --> 00:15:15.840
Well, here's the thing. It did work in a unique way,

232
00:15:16.120 --> 00:15:19.080
in a way that was in the end kind of helpful.

233
00:15:20.240 --> 00:15:23.960
Investigators determine the knife used to cut the cord would

234
00:15:24.080 --> 00:15:29.679
show burn marks and a nicked blade. Oh okay, we'll

235
00:15:29.759 --> 00:15:31.360
just put a pin in that for now.

236
00:15:31.759 --> 00:15:32.440
I like that.

237
00:15:33.200 --> 00:15:36.840
Uh huh, I like where this is going. Only that

238
00:15:37.000 --> 00:15:38.000
particular part.

239
00:15:39.120 --> 00:15:41.559
But that is so crazy that he like looked around

240
00:15:41.600 --> 00:15:44.360
the room and was like, yep, that's the only thing

241
00:15:44.399 --> 00:15:48.679
I can like right, and like planning it in your head. Now,

242
00:15:49.240 --> 00:15:52.759
these other people don't know what you're thinking, and they

243
00:15:52.840 --> 00:15:56.320
just think it's a normal day and all of a sudden,

244
00:15:56.360 --> 00:16:01.759
the cord is cut. Yeah, and you're being attacked.

245
00:16:02.840 --> 00:16:07.919
It's pretty horrifying, Like it's hard to imagine what would

246
00:16:07.919 --> 00:16:09.799
be going through your head at that moment.

247
00:16:11.159 --> 00:16:13.519
I'm never leaving my house again, and no one's ever

248
00:16:13.600 --> 00:16:14.039
coming in.

249
00:16:14.840 --> 00:16:16.879
Okay, I was going to say, you know, the thing

250
00:16:17.039 --> 00:16:20.159
is a lot of these people were in their homes

251
00:16:20.279 --> 00:16:28.200
or coming in. Yeah, no one's invited over vampire rules. Yeah, exactly.

252
00:16:28.320 --> 00:16:29.360
You have to be invited.

253
00:16:30.720 --> 00:16:34.120
Three days later, on June fourth, Nelson strangled twenty seven

254
00:16:34.200 --> 00:16:39.559
year old Mary Cecilia Sietsma of Chicago, Illinois, with an

255
00:16:39.600 --> 00:16:43.120
appliance cord. So he kind of goes through like these

256
00:16:43.159 --> 00:16:46.799
sort of phases where it's like he's he's liking a

257
00:16:46.919 --> 00:16:48.759
specific thing that he's.

258
00:16:48.600 --> 00:16:53.759
Finding and using. And I hate that because he does

259
00:16:53.799 --> 00:16:55.039
it so often.

260
00:16:55.399 --> 00:16:59.679
Like yeah, like you can tell there's certain things that

261
00:16:59.720 --> 00:17:03.519
it's like he's like, oh this is interesting, or you know,

262
00:17:03.639 --> 00:17:09.559
this is I like how this works, or I don't

263
00:17:09.680 --> 00:17:16.359
want my head to exist in that space. Her body

264
00:17:16.440 --> 00:17:19.279
was discovered by her husband on the floor of their home.

265
00:17:20.720 --> 00:17:22.640
Another poor husband.

266
00:17:24.160 --> 00:17:27.559
I mean, the good news is that we are nearing

267
00:17:27.759 --> 00:17:33.240
the end of the actual spree. Okay, we're getting We're

268
00:17:33.240 --> 00:17:40.839
getting We're getting close, sir. Days later, reportedly June eighth

269
00:17:40.880 --> 00:17:44.799
of nineteen twenty seven, Nelson was crossing the border into

270
00:17:44.880 --> 00:17:50.680
Canada hitching a ride with the Chandler family of Minnesota, Minnesota.

271
00:17:52.319 --> 00:17:55.519
They described him as well dressed in a blue suit,

272
00:17:55.799 --> 00:17:59.799
gray cap, and tan shoes, though he was apparently carrying

273
00:18:00.960 --> 00:18:05.960
nothing else, no bible, nothing, That's what they said. Another

274
00:18:06.039 --> 00:18:11.000
motorists later reported giving Nelson a ride further on from Emerson,

275
00:18:11.160 --> 00:18:15.839
Manitoba to Winnipeg that same day, which is like Jesus

276
00:18:15.880 --> 00:18:20.359
fucking Christ, there are two people in their vehicle, like

277
00:18:20.640 --> 00:18:23.720
an entire family in the first one that they are

278
00:18:23.960 --> 00:18:25.279
so lucky.

279
00:18:25.359 --> 00:18:28.079
Do you think he would take out like a whole family, though.

280
00:18:28.359 --> 00:18:30.039
I'm not sure that he would have been able to,

281
00:18:30.759 --> 00:18:35.640
And I will say that it seems like that is

282
00:18:36.240 --> 00:18:39.759
probably from both like a physical like because it is

283
00:18:39.880 --> 00:18:43.599
very difficult for like a single attacker to take out

284
00:18:43.640 --> 00:18:48.200
an entire family unless they have like just an insane advantage.

285
00:18:48.880 --> 00:18:53.359
Of course, being confined in a single vehicle is you know,

286
00:18:53.519 --> 00:18:56.000
one way that you might be able to accomplish that.

287
00:18:56.240 --> 00:18:59.799
But more than anything, I think psychologically I'm not sure

288
00:18:59.839 --> 00:19:04.920
that he could have done that, because it really seems

289
00:19:05.519 --> 00:19:11.480
that in the cases where there are survivors, you see

290
00:19:11.519 --> 00:19:15.319
that like when he's met with even the slightest resistance

291
00:19:15.680 --> 00:19:18.519
where they don't do things exactly the way that he

292
00:19:18.640 --> 00:19:21.680
wants in order to like carry out his mo o,

293
00:19:22.319 --> 00:19:27.480
like he just leaves. Yeah, so I think he could

294
00:19:27.480 --> 00:19:31.920
have escalated at some point to that level. I don't

295
00:19:31.960 --> 00:19:34.759
think that like, oh, he's just not capable of that

296
00:19:34.880 --> 00:19:35.640
kind of evil.

297
00:19:35.960 --> 00:19:39.079
He I mean, yeah, he definitely is.

298
00:19:39.200 --> 00:19:43.680
He he strangled an eight month old baby, like that's

299
00:19:43.720 --> 00:19:47.680
not beyond him. But I just don't think that it's

300
00:19:47.799 --> 00:19:51.079
in his nature for other reasons, if that makes sense.

301
00:19:51.960 --> 00:19:54.240
And was that was there a man in the car too,

302
00:19:54.920 --> 00:19:56.519
like a like a mom and dad?

303
00:19:56.559 --> 00:19:59.319
And yeah, it sounds like it was a whole family,

304
00:20:00.079 --> 00:20:04.559
because I doubt that a woman driving into Canada with

305
00:20:04.640 --> 00:20:10.440
her small children would have picked up a lone male hitchhiker,

306
00:20:10.559 --> 00:20:14.559
even at this time, right, I just I don't see

307
00:20:14.960 --> 00:20:18.480
that many women would have done that. Obviously, it is

308
00:20:18.480 --> 00:20:21.279
always a possibility, But yeah, I think that's the other

309
00:20:21.359 --> 00:20:25.160
thing is I think there being a man present clearly

310
00:20:25.200 --> 00:20:31.440
that changes the dynamics for him. On June eighth, in Winnipeg, Manitoba,

311
00:20:31.680 --> 00:20:36.680
fourteen year old Lola Cowan of three University Places, was

312
00:20:36.720 --> 00:20:40.599
selling artificial flowers door to door to help support her family.

313
00:20:41.440 --> 00:20:46.160
Oh Nelson lured her into his rented room at Catherine

314
00:20:46.240 --> 00:20:52.039
Hill's boarding house at one thirty three Smith Street. Her

315
00:20:52.119 --> 00:20:58.079
body and this goes back to escalation reportedly mutilated in

316
00:20:58.119 --> 00:21:03.519
a manner period reports described as reminiscent of Jack the

317
00:21:03.640 --> 00:21:07.359
Ripper's victims Oh my god, would not be found for days,

318
00:21:08.039 --> 00:21:10.759
and that's really horrifying because she's another one of his

319
00:21:10.920 --> 00:21:15.039
like very young victims. It's a level of aggression in

320
00:21:15.119 --> 00:21:20.559
violence that he hasn't stereotypically exhibited. So I feel like

321
00:21:20.599 --> 00:21:26.279
it does speak to like him. Escalating. Evidence also indicated

322
00:21:26.400 --> 00:21:30.079
Nelson slept in the bed above her corpse overnight.

323
00:21:30.599 --> 00:21:31.680
Ew.

324
00:21:32.640 --> 00:21:40.559
Yeah, I mean he doesn't care, no, clearly very unbothered. Later,

325
00:21:41.240 --> 00:21:44.799
Nelson was still in Winnipeg when he killed twenty seven

326
00:21:44.880 --> 00:21:49.799
year old Emily Patterson of one hundred Riverton Avenue, who,

327
00:21:49.880 --> 00:21:53.880
in addition to the strangulation and sexual assault standard to

328
00:21:54.000 --> 00:21:57.799
his MO, was also bludgeoned with a clawhammer.

329
00:21:59.319 --> 00:22:01.960
Wow, so he's getting pretty violent.

330
00:22:02.720 --> 00:22:06.039
Yes, I mean, this is a level of like devastation

331
00:22:06.319 --> 00:22:11.400
and destruction to their bodies that we have not seen

332
00:22:11.559 --> 00:22:16.559
with his prior victims. Her body was left underneath her

333
00:22:17.079 --> 00:22:22.440
young son's bed and discovered by her husband as he

334
00:22:22.519 --> 00:22:25.880
knelt at the bedside to say evening prayers.

335
00:22:26.279 --> 00:22:31.960
Oh my god, that is the worst thing I've ever heard.

336
00:22:31.680 --> 00:22:34.640
I know, And it's like it's I don't know, there's

337
00:22:34.640 --> 00:22:37.839
something about it where it's like, you know, not all

338
00:22:37.880 --> 00:22:41.839
people that are religious, are good people? Like I think

339
00:22:42.000 --> 00:22:45.640
we all understand that, but there's something that's it's like

340
00:22:45.720 --> 00:22:49.200
such a wholesome image of this man, like kneeling down

341
00:22:49.359 --> 00:22:54.200
beside his child's bed to say evening prayers and then

342
00:22:54.359 --> 00:22:57.880
that's how he discovers this horrific thing has been done

343
00:22:58.799 --> 00:23:05.039
to his wife, and to leave her there underneath her

344
00:23:05.200 --> 00:23:07.039
child's bed like.

345
00:23:07.759 --> 00:23:11.720
That is so gross. It is wrong with him.

346
00:23:12.480 --> 00:23:17.000
I know, and for somebody that was just such a

347
00:23:17.079 --> 00:23:20.119
fucking nut about religion, it's like.

348
00:23:21.599 --> 00:23:22.559
That image is.

349
00:23:22.640 --> 00:23:26.599
Just I don't know, it's so unsettling. It's just it's

350
00:23:26.680 --> 00:23:34.279
really disturbing. Nelson stole a whipcord suit, Emily's gold wedding ring,

351
00:23:34.599 --> 00:23:40.359
the family Bible, and seventy dollars Canadian in.

352
00:23:40.359 --> 00:23:42.839
Ten dollar bills.

353
00:23:43.359 --> 00:23:48.960
He also left behind a knife bearing burn marks and

354
00:23:49.039 --> 00:23:56.720
a nicked blade. Oh, the same distinctive damage that would

355
00:23:56.720 --> 00:23:59.759
have been seen on the knife used to cut the

356
00:24:00.000 --> 00:24:04.160
electrical cord in the Fannie May murder in Detroit just

357
00:24:04.720 --> 00:24:06.559
nine days earlier.

358
00:24:07.519 --> 00:24:09.559
Holy shit, he's done so much.

359
00:24:10.519 --> 00:24:13.960
Yeah, he is doing the absolute most, and I must

360
00:24:14.079 --> 00:24:17.599
insist that he just takes several seats.

361
00:24:20.920 --> 00:24:21.920
I have to look this up.

362
00:24:22.000 --> 00:24:24.359
I never did end up looking up what a whipcord

363
00:24:24.480 --> 00:24:27.559
suit was, and I was curious, but I was like,

364
00:24:27.720 --> 00:24:30.880
I have so much to do. Oh, it's literally just

365
00:24:30.960 --> 00:24:34.759
a man's suit. I don't know why they call it

366
00:24:34.839 --> 00:24:41.160
that whipcord a sturdy worsted wool or cotton fabric.

367
00:24:42.000 --> 00:24:43.599
Oh, so he took it so he would like have

368
00:24:43.680 --> 00:24:45.480
something nice to wear. I guess.

369
00:24:45.559 --> 00:24:46.960
So that's what I'm thinking.

370
00:24:47.759 --> 00:24:50.480
And he got his Bible back. He could be Bible man,

371
00:24:50.559 --> 00:24:50.880
I guess.

372
00:24:50.960 --> 00:24:53.400
Yeah, he didn't have a Bible when he was crossing

373
00:24:53.440 --> 00:24:56.680
the border, apparently, so he took theirs, which is just

374
00:24:57.079 --> 00:24:58.599
like fuck you.

375
00:25:01.000 --> 00:25:02.440
So, I mean, we kind of touched on this.

376
00:25:02.640 --> 00:25:07.680
But the claw hammer was a striking departure from Nelson's

377
00:25:07.720 --> 00:25:13.079
otherwise strangulation consistent method, and, together with the mutilation of

378
00:25:13.279 --> 00:25:18.400
Lola Cowan two days prior, has been read by later

379
00:25:18.480 --> 00:25:23.680
analysts as evidence of psychological deterioration in the final week

380
00:25:23.880 --> 00:25:27.160
of the spree. And I may not be a qualified

381
00:25:27.200 --> 00:25:32.279
analyst of really almost anything, but I'm inclined to agree

382
00:25:32.319 --> 00:25:33.720
for whatever that's worth.

383
00:25:34.359 --> 00:25:36.319
Right, it sounds right, it sounds right.

384
00:25:36.839 --> 00:25:41.240
Yeah, you know what. I can't always find the right

385
00:25:41.319 --> 00:25:44.359
mouth words but when I hear them sometimes I'm like, that's.

386
00:25:44.160 --> 00:25:46.240
It that resonates.

387
00:25:46.440 --> 00:25:50.160
Yeah, there it is, you know what what they said.

388
00:25:51.039 --> 00:25:51.839
Yeah.

389
00:25:52.279 --> 00:25:57.880
The day after Patterson's murder, Winnipeg jeweler Fred England unknowingly

390
00:25:58.000 --> 00:26:03.920
purchased Emily Patterson's wedding ring from Nelson. Later that afternoon,

391
00:26:04.039 --> 00:26:07.519
Nelson traded the whipcord suit and other clothing that he

392
00:26:07.559 --> 00:26:11.640
had stolen from the Patterson home at Sam Waldman's second

393
00:26:11.640 --> 00:26:12.279
hand store.

394
00:26:13.079 --> 00:26:16.720
Oh okay, well I was wrong, but whatever what oh

395
00:26:16.759 --> 00:26:19.079
I said? He wanted like the nice suit to trick

396
00:26:19.160 --> 00:26:21.400
people to like wear it, so he just sold it.

397
00:26:21.960 --> 00:26:23.519
I kind of thought so too.

398
00:26:23.640 --> 00:26:27.839
But maybe he didn't want anything that looked distinctive. Maybe

399
00:26:27.880 --> 00:26:30.240
he didn't want anything that was going to like set

400
00:26:30.319 --> 00:26:32.839
him apart. So like maybe he wanted to change out

401
00:26:32.839 --> 00:26:36.839
his clothes. But what he wanted because it does say

402
00:26:36.920 --> 00:26:40.319
trade it, So maybe what he wanted was something that

403
00:26:40.400 --> 00:26:43.359
was just like a little bit more run of the mill, right,

404
00:26:43.640 --> 00:26:47.440
And he's an opportunist, But also he does a lot

405
00:26:47.480 --> 00:26:49.559
of things that like just straight up don't make sense.

406
00:26:49.599 --> 00:26:53.039
So I mean, who knows, there's no way to know

407
00:26:53.880 --> 00:26:58.680
a barber next door Nicholas taber gave a man matching

408
00:26:59.240 --> 00:27:04.920
Nelson's description a shave, haircut, and massage, noticing dried blood

409
00:27:05.000 --> 00:27:09.240
and scratch marks on his scalp. When asked about them,

410
00:27:09.519 --> 00:27:12.880
the man grew agitated and asked the barber not to

411
00:27:12.880 --> 00:27:14.559
touch them.

412
00:27:14.680 --> 00:27:17.000
I got attacked by a squirrel. Leave me alone.

413
00:27:17.519 --> 00:27:20.119
Yeah, don't ask me any questions, and I won't tell

414
00:27:20.119 --> 00:27:25.559
you any laughs. On June twelfth, during a city wide

415
00:27:25.599 --> 00:27:30.519
search of Winnipeg boarding houses, police entered Catherine Hill's boarding

416
00:27:30.519 --> 00:27:35.319
house at one thirty three Smith Street and discovered Lola

417
00:27:35.440 --> 00:27:39.000
Cowan's decaying body beneath the bed of the room Nelson

418
00:27:39.039 --> 00:27:45.519
had recently occupied. The Winnipeg City Council posted a fifteen

419
00:27:45.640 --> 00:27:51.680
hundred dollars Canadian reward for information leading to conviction. The

420
00:27:51.799 --> 00:27:55.480
reward would later become a point of dispute as multiple

421
00:27:55.519 --> 00:27:59.400
tipsters came forward because of course, I mean there's money involved,

422
00:27:59.440 --> 00:28:03.680
so we have to have some sort of bickering. Likely

423
00:28:04.000 --> 00:28:08.079
seriously feeling the heat, Nelson fled south by hitchhiking and

424
00:28:08.160 --> 00:28:12.160
stowing away on trains aiming for the United States border.

425
00:28:12.839 --> 00:28:17.039
On June fourteenth, a man claiming to be Mike Mouski

426
00:28:17.720 --> 00:28:22.359
was arrested at the war Road, Minnesota border crossing by

427
00:28:22.480 --> 00:28:25.519
US Customs officers, but escape the next day.

428
00:28:26.279 --> 00:28:30.400
Because he who denis that's how he do? Yeah, so

429
00:28:30.480 --> 00:28:33.640
does he? Who DD's Mike Mouski.

430
00:28:34.519 --> 00:28:45.160
Yeah it's Mickey mouse So Mouseki is spelled Mowski. I

431
00:28:45.160 --> 00:28:49.160
think it was meant to sound like an Eastern European name,

432
00:28:50.000 --> 00:28:56.119
that's my guess. But then on my mom's birthday June sixteenth,

433
00:28:56.200 --> 00:29:02.400
nineteen twenty seven, constables in Killarney, a border town approximately

434
00:29:02.400 --> 00:29:07.640
twelve miles from North Dakota, arrested a calm, cooperative man

435
00:29:07.680 --> 00:29:10.599
calling himself Virgil Wilson.

436
00:29:12.000 --> 00:29:13.880
I'm Virgil Wilson. Now.

437
00:29:14.599 --> 00:29:20.559
Yeah, his demeanor was so unremarkable that the arresting constables

438
00:29:20.880 --> 00:29:24.319
believed they had the wrong man. They were like, this

439
00:29:24.599 --> 00:29:25.839
obviously can't be him.

440
00:29:26.400 --> 00:29:30.400
He just is like so chill. Oh my god. I know,

441
00:29:30.960 --> 00:29:33.559
I don't even know what to say about that. I know.

442
00:29:33.839 --> 00:29:37.839
I well, listen, this is long before there was any

443
00:29:37.920 --> 00:29:41.039
sort of like precedent for like, okay, we have to

444
00:29:41.079 --> 00:29:44.160
stop saying things like oh, he looked so normal like

445
00:29:44.200 --> 00:29:48.400
the Boogeyman. He might look surprisingly normal.

446
00:29:49.119 --> 00:29:50.519
Yeah, for real.

447
00:29:51.279 --> 00:29:56.079
Like, actually, it's incredibly likely he's gonna look just like

448
00:29:56.160 --> 00:29:57.720
you are you are you are? You?

449
00:29:58.160 --> 00:30:01.640
Like, didn't you start off episode one saying this very

450
00:30:01.720 --> 00:30:05.119
same thing? Yeah? Interesting, I believe so.

451
00:30:06.640 --> 00:30:10.559
Weird, you know what. I am glad someone is paying attention.

452
00:30:11.960 --> 00:30:16.559
I try so really this is I mean, it's just

453
00:30:16.599 --> 00:30:20.160
such a fun little part of the story here.

454
00:30:20.640 --> 00:30:21.839
I know you're gonna be shocked.

455
00:30:22.400 --> 00:30:27.680
Nelson escaped the century old Killarney cell that night by

456
00:30:27.680 --> 00:30:31.480
picking the lock, but made a fatal mistake when he

457
00:30:31.519 --> 00:30:35.640
attempted to board the same train carrying Winnipeg police on

458
00:30:35.799 --> 00:30:40.920
the hunt to retrieve him.

459
00:30:41.079 --> 00:30:41.440
Ah.

460
00:30:41.480 --> 00:30:45.039
Shit, the first half is exactly what you think it's

461
00:30:45.039 --> 00:30:47.319
gonna be, and then the second half is kind of

462
00:30:47.359 --> 00:30:48.720
like the m Night Twist.

463
00:30:49.119 --> 00:30:51.519
And I love that. Yeah.

464
00:30:51.599 --> 00:30:53.079
I was like, you deserve it.

465
00:30:53.799 --> 00:30:56.000
He did. Yeah.

466
00:30:56.200 --> 00:30:59.880
So he was recaptured roughly twelve hours after his initials

467
00:31:00.599 --> 00:31:04.599
by an officer of the Crystal City, Manitoba Police Department

468
00:31:05.279 --> 00:31:10.160
on the rail line seventy five kilometers east of Wakopa.

469
00:31:10.400 --> 00:31:13.279
I hope I'm saying that right, but you know, stay stupid,

470
00:31:13.359 --> 00:31:15.240
I guess now.

471
00:31:15.640 --> 00:31:19.000
I'm just still like picturing him walking into the train

472
00:31:19.119 --> 00:31:22.400
and everyone just looks at him and they're all staring

473
00:31:22.440 --> 00:31:27.200
at each other like wait, wait that is that the guy?

474
00:31:28.039 --> 00:31:34.640
Is the guy? Like he's like, ah, there's just no way.

475
00:31:37.519 --> 00:31:41.440
Nelson was taken to the Rupert Street Police station in Winnipeg,

476
00:31:41.680 --> 00:31:47.200
where he was photographed, fingerprinted, measured, and prepared for identification lineups.

477
00:31:48.039 --> 00:31:54.440
Thousands of spectators gathered outside the station. Fun fact about

478
00:31:54.640 --> 00:31:58.119
this case, and I hadn't initially included it in my notes,

479
00:31:58.480 --> 00:32:00.640
and I think I just was like, I he says,

480
00:32:00.640 --> 00:32:04.039
there's so much to research and things to verify and

481
00:32:04.079 --> 00:32:10.039
all of that. I read that reportedly up to a

482
00:32:10.119 --> 00:32:16.440
thousand Canadian farmers just casually joined search parties that were

483
00:32:16.440 --> 00:32:20.839
like on the hunt for him. Oh so thousands of

484
00:32:20.880 --> 00:32:24.480
spectators showing up at the police station in Winnipeg when

485
00:32:24.559 --> 00:32:30.599
he's like actually recaptured, recaptured like that part, I was like,

486
00:32:30.680 --> 00:32:34.119
you know what I that that feels about, right Like

487
00:32:34.119 --> 00:32:34.960
at the house, they.

488
00:32:34.880 --> 00:32:38.759
Were all looking for him, and they're like, yeah.

489
00:32:37.720 --> 00:32:41.000
And this was a big fucking deal just in general,

490
00:32:41.079 --> 00:32:44.759
and we'll talk about that more later because you know,

491
00:32:44.960 --> 00:32:48.440
old timey things and we'll get there. But I just

492
00:32:48.599 --> 00:32:51.920
was like, wow, like I love that piece of it.

493
00:32:52.079 --> 00:32:55.759
How much people just were like, we got to get

494
00:32:55.759 --> 00:32:57.960
this guy. They were really invested.

495
00:32:58.279 --> 00:32:59.759
Get this fucking guy out of here.

496
00:33:00.599 --> 00:33:05.920
Hey, yeah, get him the fuck out. Sergeant James Hoskins

497
00:33:06.079 --> 00:33:09.359
of the Winnipeg Police noted that the clothing Nelson was

498
00:33:09.400 --> 00:33:13.400
wearing was the same clothing Sam Waldman had received in

499
00:33:13.480 --> 00:33:16.920
trade for the wick Cord suit stolen from the Patterson home,

500
00:33:18.000 --> 00:33:22.319
physical evidence tying Nelson directly to the murder scene, so

501
00:33:22.359 --> 00:33:24.799
they were able to identify. Like, Okay, so the guy

502
00:33:24.799 --> 00:33:28.720
that gave us the stolen clothing from the family, this

503
00:33:28.880 --> 00:33:32.160
is what he got in trade and he's wearing it.

504
00:33:33.240 --> 00:33:35.519
So he should have just taken money and went to

505
00:33:35.599 --> 00:33:42.119
a different store. Yep, No, I mean, stay stupid. I

506
00:33:42.279 --> 00:33:45.559
love that. I love that the store owner just knows

507
00:33:45.640 --> 00:33:49.039
what clothes were his or hers or whatever. Right.

508
00:33:50.359 --> 00:33:55.400
Captain Mathison of the San Francisco Police Department personally traveled

509
00:33:55.440 --> 00:34:00.000
to Winnipeg with Nelson's fingerprint records from a prior californi

510
00:34:00.039 --> 00:34:03.920
Ornia arrest. The prints were a match, and his identity

511
00:34:04.039 --> 00:34:09.039
as Virgil Wilson collapsed. By the end of Nelson's first

512
00:34:09.039 --> 00:34:13.800
week in custody, more than forty witnesses had identified Nelson

513
00:34:13.880 --> 00:34:18.039
either in lineups or from photographs. A lot of people

514
00:34:18.199 --> 00:34:19.519
those are cosby numbers.

515
00:34:19.559 --> 00:34:23.000
Baby him in his big hands and greasy hair.

516
00:34:24.159 --> 00:34:29.159
Arguably the most damning was Catherine Hill's positive identification of

517
00:34:29.239 --> 00:34:31.519
him as the man who had rented the room in

518
00:34:31.559 --> 00:34:36.800
which Lola Cowan died. That'll do it, yep, not older.

519
00:34:38.400 --> 00:34:42.039
When first asked about the murders, Nelson bluntly told a reporter,

520
00:34:42.360 --> 00:34:45.320
I only do my lady killings on Saturday nights.

521
00:34:46.159 --> 00:34:57.400
Oh sir, what he told a dad joke about murder, right, like, ugh,

522
00:34:57.639 --> 00:35:01.280
U exqueeze me butthole.

523
00:35:01.960 --> 00:35:08.039
What an actual anus wow. But of course, he would

524
00:35:08.079 --> 00:35:11.840
later retract this and refuse to confess to anything, insisting

525
00:35:11.920 --> 00:35:16.159
to the Manitoba Free Press, I'm charged with two murders,

526
00:35:16.400 --> 00:35:18.920
but I'm not the one who'd done it, not the

527
00:35:18.960 --> 00:35:19.639
one who'd done it.

528
00:35:19.719 --> 00:35:26.119
See, I just the dad joke killer god.

529
00:35:28.400 --> 00:35:31.960
When asked how so many witnesses in so many cities

530
00:35:32.079 --> 00:35:34.880
had identified him, he said, all of them are wrong.

531
00:35:36.000 --> 00:35:37.480
I could be anybody.

532
00:35:37.599 --> 00:35:39.480
I look like everybody. What do you mean, right?

533
00:35:40.239 --> 00:35:44.760
No, I'm sorry, I just like that. Many people I

534
00:35:44.920 --> 00:35:50.920
just don't believe are wrong. Also, all of the physical evidence, yeah, duh.

535
00:35:51.960 --> 00:35:55.039
Within weeks of his arrest. Though he was wanted for

536
00:35:55.199 --> 00:36:01.599
murder in several other jurisdictions, including San Francisco, in Detroit, Philadelphia,

537
00:36:01.639 --> 00:36:05.639
and Buffalo, just to name a few, it was determined

538
00:36:05.760 --> 00:36:09.280
that he would be first tried in Manitoba, which still

539
00:36:09.320 --> 00:36:11.159
had the death penalty at that time.

540
00:36:11.679 --> 00:36:13.840
Ha ha Yeah.

541
00:36:14.679 --> 00:36:18.679
Capital punishment would not be abolished for civilians in Canada

542
00:36:18.840 --> 00:36:23.320
until the summer of nineteen seventy six, and for military

543
00:36:23.360 --> 00:36:28.039
offenses full abolishment would not come until nineteen ninety eight.

544
00:36:28.639 --> 00:36:32.760
So I guess he should have just waited until then

545
00:36:33.000 --> 00:36:36.719
to do all of his murdering in Canadia.

546
00:36:36.840 --> 00:36:38.400
Dummy. Oh well.

547
00:36:39.519 --> 00:36:43.039
Nelson's trial was scheduled to begin June twenty seventh of

548
00:36:43.159 --> 00:36:47.679
nineteen twenty seven, but was postponed at his attorney's request,

549
00:36:47.960 --> 00:36:52.119
finally beginning November one at the Winnipeg Law Courts building.

550
00:36:52.840 --> 00:36:54.679
And it looks kneku.

551
00:36:55.840 --> 00:36:56.280
Oh yeah.

552
00:36:56.960 --> 00:36:58.920
I don't know if the building looks exactly like it

553
00:36:58.960 --> 00:37:01.480
did back in nineteen twenty seven, but the picture I

554
00:37:01.519 --> 00:37:02.840
saw lekum.

555
00:37:03.840 --> 00:37:06.039
The case was prosecuted by R. B.

556
00:37:06.400 --> 00:37:14.079
Graham before Justice Andrew Dysert and James Herbert Stitt. I

557
00:37:14.239 --> 00:37:19.159
just this so many names serving as this court appointed defense,

558
00:37:19.679 --> 00:37:25.159
so Stitt is his defense lawyer. Though Nelson was tried

559
00:37:25.320 --> 00:37:29.559
only for the murder of Emily Patterson, fingerprints from other

560
00:37:29.639 --> 00:37:33.840
crime scenes were a match, and dental impressions taken at

561
00:37:33.880 --> 00:37:37.480
the time of his arrest also matched bite marks found

562
00:37:37.519 --> 00:37:38.880
on victims.

563
00:37:38.800 --> 00:37:44.800
Oo and his hard teeth. Yeah, I didn't you like

564
00:37:44.880 --> 00:37:46.840
pick things up with his teeth or something?

565
00:37:47.079 --> 00:37:50.159
Yeah, yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, yep, yep.

566
00:37:50.840 --> 00:37:51.079
Yeah.

567
00:37:51.159 --> 00:37:53.880
That that's something that came up in his life, like

568
00:37:53.920 --> 00:37:54.760
pretty early on.

569
00:37:55.119 --> 00:37:57.079
So I hate it.

570
00:37:58.800 --> 00:38:02.119
Of course, through a modern lends, this specific aspect of

571
00:38:02.239 --> 00:38:06.639
forensic odontology has far less credibility than it did at

572
00:38:06.679 --> 00:38:10.320
the time, but the mountain of other evidence and statements

573
00:38:10.559 --> 00:38:12.239
stacked up heavily against him.

574
00:38:12.440 --> 00:38:14.760
So even if you want to.

575
00:38:14.679 --> 00:38:18.559
Play Devil's advocate and be like, well, forensic odontologies kind

576
00:38:18.559 --> 00:38:23.440
of like especially bite marks, and you know that's.

577
00:38:23.280 --> 00:38:26.039
Not all they had, so piped out.

578
00:38:27.039 --> 00:38:30.800
Investigators had also matched the knife recovered at the Patterson

579
00:38:30.920 --> 00:38:36.159
scene with its distinctive burn marks and nicked blade to

580
00:38:36.199 --> 00:38:39.360
the knife used to cut the electrical cord that garrotted

581
00:38:39.400 --> 00:38:44.239
Fannie May in Detroit physically linking Nelson to crimes he

582
00:38:44.280 --> 00:38:50.079
had committed across the international border. Over sixty witnesses from

583
00:38:50.119 --> 00:38:54.639
both Canada and the United States testified, many placing Nelson

584
00:38:54.800 --> 00:38:58.760
at the scenes of crimes or linking him to stolen property.

585
00:38:59.400 --> 00:39:04.480
Nelson's ex wife, Mary Martin, testified against him, calling him

586
00:39:04.519 --> 00:39:07.320
absolutely insane, which shit.

587
00:39:08.239 --> 00:39:09.199
Normally I would.

588
00:39:08.960 --> 00:39:11.800
Say that is not a polite thing to say about

589
00:39:11.840 --> 00:39:16.039
your grandson's slash husband. But you know, if the shoe.

590
00:39:15.840 --> 00:39:19.920
Fits, yeah. Oh. Doctor Alvin T.

591
00:39:20.199 --> 00:39:25.079
Mathers, chief of the psychiatric ward at Winnipeg General Hospital,

592
00:39:25.239 --> 00:39:30.000
testified that after examining Nelson five times between July and

593
00:39:30.079 --> 00:39:34.440
October of nineteen twenty seven, he had quote not found

594
00:39:34.480 --> 00:39:38.480
any evidence that to me would constitute insanity.

595
00:39:39.280 --> 00:39:40.079
No evidence.

596
00:39:40.880 --> 00:39:44.119
I think he means, you know, in the legal sense.

597
00:39:44.280 --> 00:39:44.639
Okay.

598
00:39:44.679 --> 00:39:47.000
This is not to say that like he's not like

599
00:39:47.360 --> 00:39:51.079
what woo, like there's a screw loose. Something ain't right,

600
00:39:51.239 --> 00:39:52.920
the boy ain't right, buck.

601
00:39:52.760 --> 00:39:56.079
Okay, but he can't like plea insanity or whatever. Right, Okay,

602
00:39:56.159 --> 00:39:58.840
get it. I'm like, no, he's crazy. What do you mean?

603
00:39:58.880 --> 00:40:05.639
You're like it? But he's like so crazy. A jail

604
00:40:05.679 --> 00:40:08.960
guard who supervised Nelson throughout the trial, noted that he

605
00:40:09.000 --> 00:40:11.920
had become fixated on a passage from the Book of

606
00:40:12.119 --> 00:40:16.880
Proverbs and read it aloud repeatedly, which is not at

607
00:40:16.880 --> 00:40:22.920
all annoying and obnoxious. Okay, I will read it for you,

608
00:40:23.440 --> 00:40:26.760
and then yeah, I will tell you all about why

609
00:40:26.840 --> 00:40:33.119
I fucking hate it. Okay, my son, give me thine

610
00:40:33.159 --> 00:40:37.960
heart and let thine eyes observe my ways. For a

611
00:40:38.000 --> 00:40:41.800
whore is a deep ditch, and a strange woman is

612
00:40:41.840 --> 00:40:45.800
a narrow pit. She also lieth in wait as for

613
00:40:45.920 --> 00:40:51.880
a prey, and increaseth the transgressors among men. Now, if

614
00:40:51.920 --> 00:40:55.159
I were to try to explain that to you in

615
00:40:56.079 --> 00:41:00.960
slightly plainar English, I might say something like, every single

616
00:41:01.000 --> 00:41:04.760
one of his victims fits the biblical definition of a

617
00:41:05.079 --> 00:41:10.559
quote unquote strange woman. Women running boarding houses or showing

618
00:41:10.599 --> 00:41:13.960
properties without the oversight of a man, whether they were

619
00:41:14.440 --> 00:41:18.679
unmarried or widowed, women who were basically just managing their

620
00:41:18.679 --> 00:41:25.159
own affairs, Like, can you even imagine that audacity? The

621
00:41:25.320 --> 00:41:30.199
exact demographic he was hunting is the very same one

622
00:41:30.320 --> 00:41:35.119
the passage warns men to be fearful of. That's not scripture,

623
00:41:35.639 --> 00:41:40.159
it's a hit list with a theological alibi. Damn, it's

624
00:41:40.239 --> 00:41:46.559
particularly gross textbook victim blaming. The women he murdered were

625
00:41:46.599 --> 00:41:51.559
being framed in his deluded mind as the predators because

626
00:41:52.199 --> 00:41:57.920
he wasn't stalking them, they were tempting him, like.

627
00:41:58.119 --> 00:42:00.280
What was she wearing you?

628
00:42:01.920 --> 00:42:07.360
He wasn't strangling them, he was escaping the traps of

629
00:42:07.480 --> 00:42:14.360
their feminine wiles. My god, it's honestly the oldest trick

630
00:42:14.400 --> 00:42:18.320
in the book, and Nelson didn't invent it. He just

631
00:42:18.440 --> 00:42:21.840
baptized it and passed it down to future in cells.

632
00:42:22.159 --> 00:42:23.679
I hate this so much.

633
00:42:24.119 --> 00:42:27.159
I'm That's all I have to say about that is

634
00:42:27.199 --> 00:42:31.199
that it Are you sure you done? We have to

635
00:42:31.280 --> 00:42:31.639
move on?

636
00:42:32.280 --> 00:42:32.519
Yeah?

637
00:42:32.559 --> 00:42:35.400
No, I mean I could literally expound for days. I

638
00:42:35.480 --> 00:42:38.400
mean the amount of time that I spent on the

639
00:42:38.440 --> 00:42:43.119
reflection on that, Like I don't know, four lines of scripture.

640
00:42:43.679 --> 00:42:45.760
No, while you're reading it, I was like, did wait

641
00:42:46.039 --> 00:42:50.840
did they mean? When I think yeah, and then fancy

642
00:42:50.920 --> 00:42:54.199
words are covering up what is the same.

643
00:42:54.480 --> 00:42:57.559
Yeah, It's one of those ones where you're like, hold on, no,

644
00:42:57.639 --> 00:43:01.760
hold on, I just maybe I'm confused by the thine

645
00:43:02.440 --> 00:43:07.199
and I'm sure they didn't mean that. Well, no, they

646
00:43:07.239 --> 00:43:11.960
appear to mean just exactly that. Hmmm, No, it's exactly

647
00:43:11.960 --> 00:43:15.360
what you think. And obviously part of the problem is

648
00:43:15.400 --> 00:43:19.679
the context in which it's being used. But it's pretty

649
00:43:19.719 --> 00:43:23.400
I mean, that's a passage that's pretty problematic regardless.

650
00:43:24.079 --> 00:43:24.960
Take that out of there.

651
00:43:25.440 --> 00:43:28.199
Just like, on the face of things, we're just like

652
00:43:28.960 --> 00:43:34.519
whorees and you know, ew strange, Like, how about actually

653
00:43:34.559 --> 00:43:35.400
go fuck yourself.

654
00:43:36.519 --> 00:43:38.840
I'd rather be a strange horror than.

655
00:43:38.960 --> 00:43:41.679
Right be one of you. I know, I think I

656
00:43:41.679 --> 00:43:47.119
would rather be both a whore and arguably strange.

657
00:43:47.400 --> 00:43:48.159
I like that life.

658
00:43:48.679 --> 00:43:55.119
Yeah, I think I'm literally about that life. On November fifth,

659
00:43:55.320 --> 00:44:01.239
nineteen twenty seven, closing arguments concluded that you're deliberated for

660
00:44:01.239 --> 00:44:06.480
forty minutes before returning a guilty verdict because duh. But honestly,

661
00:44:06.519 --> 00:44:09.159
when the jury comes back that quickly, it's almost never

662
00:44:09.239 --> 00:44:14.280
a good thing for the defendant, just like statistically and anecdotally,

663
00:44:14.800 --> 00:44:18.599
I think most lawyers say that. That's what I've always heard,

664
00:44:18.840 --> 00:44:24.840
and it's carried through. Nelson received the mandatory death sentence,

665
00:44:25.639 --> 00:44:31.639
and I mandatorily Yeah, I don't normally love capital punishment,

666
00:44:31.960 --> 00:44:34.440
but I kind of I'm not going to say that.

667
00:44:34.480 --> 00:44:36.880
I you know, like I kind of love.

668
00:44:36.760 --> 00:44:40.280
That for him a little bit. Yeah, yeah, I'm not

669
00:44:40.960 --> 00:44:44.960
historically someone that considers themselves a fan, but like I

670
00:44:45.079 --> 00:44:46.159
like their latest work.

671
00:44:47.880 --> 00:44:52.159
If they're like this clearly guilty and terrible and yeah,

672
00:44:52.280 --> 00:44:53.679
just get rid of them, like we don't.

673
00:44:53.800 --> 00:44:56.360
Like it could not be any more clear cut. And

674
00:44:56.400 --> 00:44:58.239
I'm just like, you know what, the world is now

675
00:44:58.239 --> 00:45:02.000
a better place, And I know I normally just don't

676
00:45:02.039 --> 00:45:07.480
think that the system gets it correct reliably enough to

677
00:45:07.519 --> 00:45:12.880
feel confident about carrying out that sentence. That's my issue.

678
00:45:13.079 --> 00:45:17.000
But I mean, somebody wants to argue that this is

679
00:45:17.079 --> 00:45:20.880
not the guy. First of all, you're listening to the

680
00:45:20.880 --> 00:45:28.119
wrong show because you're Aloney Tune and your name is Clark.

681
00:45:28.719 --> 00:45:32.079
Yeah yeah, and I think what I think you meant

682
00:45:32.079 --> 00:45:34.880
to go to the red pill side of the internet.

683
00:45:35.079 --> 00:45:39.000
I don't know, go not wipe your buttthole over there.

684
00:45:39.519 --> 00:45:44.039
Oh my god. Oh it makes me so fucking angry,

685
00:45:44.599 --> 00:45:45.519
so disgusted.

686
00:45:46.039 --> 00:45:48.360
I've been waiting for an opportunity to bring that up again.

687
00:45:48.960 --> 00:45:51.920
I know well, and honestly I just didn't want to

688
00:45:51.920 --> 00:45:55.719
sound like a crazy feminazi the whole way through, But

689
00:45:55.840 --> 00:45:58.920
like that is what this case is giving like in

690
00:45:58.960 --> 00:46:03.880
a way, right, because it's just it's just such misogyny.

691
00:46:04.239 --> 00:46:08.920
And there's other facets of this case obviously, but like

692
00:46:09.920 --> 00:46:15.039
there's a clear hatred of women in this Like there's

693
00:46:15.239 --> 00:46:18.400
literally only a single male victim and that was a

694
00:46:18.440 --> 00:46:21.840
fucking infant, which is horrific. But like, clearly this is

695
00:46:21.880 --> 00:46:27.199
about hating women. Okay, so then this is just fucking weird.

696
00:46:29.239 --> 00:46:31.079
I I really don't know how else to put it.

697
00:46:31.760 --> 00:46:35.719
Asked whether he wished to make a statement after, you know,

698
00:46:35.760 --> 00:46:40.039
he's been given his sentence. He responded, no, not that

699
00:46:40.119 --> 00:46:44.559
I know of, And it's a weird choice of words.

700
00:46:44.000 --> 00:46:47.559
Not that I know of. Uh huh, not that anyone

701
00:46:47.599 --> 00:46:50.280
in my head is telling me, right now, I know,

702
00:46:51.119 --> 00:46:54.559
So moving on, we don't have anything to say at

703
00:46:54.599 --> 00:46:55.039
the moment.

704
00:46:56.039 --> 00:46:59.960
I know, I know, did you need to like take

705
00:47:00.079 --> 00:47:02.920
a minute, and like I don't take a poll of

706
00:47:02.960 --> 00:47:07.039
everybody that's in there, like what or what? And I

707
00:47:07.079 --> 00:47:09.960
hate to sound like like I would, you know, make

708
00:47:10.079 --> 00:47:14.159
light of anyone with like mental illness, but like at

709
00:47:14.159 --> 00:47:17.400
the same time, this is so clearly such a deranged

710
00:47:17.559 --> 00:47:22.639
and evil person that it's hurt so many innocent people

711
00:47:22.960 --> 00:47:26.599
that I just I'm sorry, I just I can't.

712
00:47:26.920 --> 00:47:30.719
I mean, it's I think arguably one of, if not.

713
00:47:30.880 --> 00:47:32.960
The worst case that I've ever covered.

714
00:47:33.280 --> 00:47:36.079
So yeah, there's a lot of women.

715
00:47:36.719 --> 00:47:42.119
Two episodes of women, children, and an actual fucking baby,

716
00:47:42.559 --> 00:47:43.280
an infant.

717
00:47:44.000 --> 00:47:46.679
So excuse me if I.

718
00:47:46.599 --> 00:47:49.280
Feel a little bit lase fair about what happens to

719
00:47:49.400 --> 00:47:52.480
him at this point, please forgive me.

720
00:47:53.559 --> 00:47:56.400
And then she was struck down by lightning?

721
00:47:58.360 --> 00:48:01.400
Can you imagine? We have had episodes It's just like

722
00:48:02.440 --> 00:48:05.480
not like for anything other than like it just was

723
00:48:05.559 --> 00:48:09.000
like cool ambiyonce, but like we've had like thunder lightning

724
00:48:09.079 --> 00:48:16.280
like in the background. But like, wow, listen, if that like,

725
00:48:16.400 --> 00:48:18.920
if that's my cross to bear, so to speak, then

726
00:48:19.039 --> 00:48:24.400
like I'm okay with that, Okay, forging ahead. Stit submitted

727
00:48:24.519 --> 00:48:29.840
a thirty page clemency petition to Minister of Justice Earnest

728
00:48:30.119 --> 00:48:35.320
Lapointe in late December, supported by twenty affidavits attesting that

729
00:48:35.360 --> 00:48:39.119
Nelson had an I quote, for a long period of time,

730
00:48:39.280 --> 00:48:42.800
been a person of unsound mind.

731
00:48:43.480 --> 00:48:47.840
M hm uh huh. Yeah, unsound is a very kind

732
00:48:47.880 --> 00:48:48.519
way to put it.

733
00:48:48.639 --> 00:48:51.199
Yeah, it mayhaps be a bit generous.

734
00:48:52.920 --> 00:48:53.800
Missus L. J.

735
00:48:54.119 --> 00:48:57.519
Casey, who had employed him as a groundskeeper in nineteen

736
00:48:57.599 --> 00:49:02.800
twenty six described him another quote, sitting right outside in

737
00:49:02.840 --> 00:49:05.960
the drenching rain, looking at the sky without a coat

738
00:49:06.239 --> 00:49:07.519
until he was soaked through.

739
00:49:08.039 --> 00:49:08.800
That's normal.

740
00:49:09.440 --> 00:49:17.119
Yeah, I'm not sure which way that supports exactly. I mean,

741
00:49:17.199 --> 00:49:20.719
I guess just that he's deeply on Well. Yeah, but

742
00:49:20.800 --> 00:49:25.079
the appeal was denied. And here's where we get some

743
00:49:25.360 --> 00:49:29.960
super I'm just a little stitious, you know, like the

744
00:49:30.079 --> 00:49:35.719
kind of like little synchronicities. The following year, on Friday,

745
00:49:36.360 --> 00:49:42.320
January thirteenth, nineteen twenty eight, after walking thirteen steps to

746
00:49:42.400 --> 00:49:48.159
the gallows at seven thirty am, Earl Leonard Nelson became

747
00:49:48.280 --> 00:49:52.599
the thirteenth person to hang at the Von Street Jail

748
00:49:52.880 --> 00:49:53.679
in Winnipeg.

749
00:49:55.039 --> 00:49:57.960
Ooh, I like all the thirteen?

750
00:49:58.679 --> 00:50:01.280
Does that not just give you like the chili willies though?

751
00:50:01.559 --> 00:50:03.840
Yeah, that's creepy.

752
00:50:05.960 --> 00:50:11.840
The hangman was Arthur Ellis, the official executioner to the

753
00:50:11.920 --> 00:50:15.920
Dominion of Canada, which is a hell of a title.

754
00:50:17.039 --> 00:50:20.960
Ellis is reported to have described the Nelson hanging as

755
00:50:21.000 --> 00:50:25.880
the one he was most satisfied to have officiated. I

756
00:50:25.920 --> 00:50:30.480
get that, Yeah, I kind of get that too. Nelson's

757
00:50:30.559 --> 00:50:34.880
last words on the platform were and this is so

758
00:50:35.039 --> 00:50:39.199
fucking infuriating. I just have to say, I declare my

759
00:50:39.360 --> 00:50:43.599
innocence before God and Man. I forgive those who have

760
00:50:43.760 --> 00:50:47.480
injured me, and I ask pardon from those I have injured,

761
00:50:47.920 --> 00:50:54.800
to which I say, nah, dude.

762
00:50:53.199 --> 00:50:55.559
But he just said he didn't hurt anybody. He's innocent,

763
00:50:55.719 --> 00:50:58.679
So who is he injured? Right? I thought you were innocent?

764
00:50:58.880 --> 00:51:02.159
So like what what? Yeah? It's interesting.

765
00:51:04.440 --> 00:51:09.480
Widely credited by crime historians Harold Scheckter and David Everett

766
00:51:09.559 --> 00:51:14.159
as the first serial sex murderer of the twentieth century

767
00:51:14.239 --> 00:51:21.679
in America, Nelson's crimes received widespread national and international coverage,

768
00:51:21.960 --> 00:51:30.239
aided by the emerging medium of broadcast radio. Ooh yeahplast news,

769
00:51:30.639 --> 00:51:35.800
I know wild times. His trial was reported on across

770
00:51:35.800 --> 00:51:39.079
the United States, Canada, and even Australia.

771
00:51:40.400 --> 00:51:45.000
Damn, Honor, They're like, what the fuck is happening up there?

772
00:51:45.079 --> 00:51:49.599
Like these Yanks are out of control over there?

773
00:51:49.679 --> 00:51:52.039
Down there. I don't know where Australia is.

774
00:51:53.960 --> 00:51:59.840
They're down You're like, I barely know where I am.

775
00:52:00.280 --> 00:52:05.920
Is that enough? His confirmed count of twenty two remained

776
00:52:05.960 --> 00:52:09.280
the highest number of murders attributed to a single US

777
00:52:09.280 --> 00:52:14.320
offender for nearly fifty years until the discovery of Juan

778
00:52:14.400 --> 00:52:22.239
Corona's crimes in California in nineteen seventy one. In criminal literature,

779
00:52:22.719 --> 00:52:27.079
Nelson is often cited as the archetype of the traveling

780
00:52:27.280 --> 00:52:32.280
or transient serial killer, a category that would later include

781
00:52:32.360 --> 00:52:38.159
Ted Bundy, Henry Lee, Lucas Ottis, Toole Otis Otis, you

782
00:52:38.239 --> 00:52:42.400
know what, who Cares? And Israel Kis. They are all

783
00:52:42.599 --> 00:52:47.599
very fucking scary. Serial Killers in general are scary, but

784
00:52:47.920 --> 00:52:53.039
like there is something so chilling about those particular individuals

785
00:52:54.320 --> 00:52:58.960
for sure. Nelson's case also demonstrates a form of inter

786
00:52:59.039 --> 00:53:04.400
state law enforcement cooperation that predates modern institutional structures, such

787
00:53:04.400 --> 00:53:10.400
as the FBI's Violent Criminal Apprehension Program known as VISCAP

788
00:53:10.960 --> 00:53:15.480
that was established in nineteen eighty five. Fingerprint records were

789
00:53:15.519 --> 00:53:20.039
physically handcarried by Captain Matheson from San Francisco to Winnipeg

790
00:53:20.239 --> 00:53:25.679
to establish Nelson's identity, and Winnipeg police sent Nelson's photograph

791
00:53:25.760 --> 00:53:30.559
to police departments throughout the United States, both costly measures

792
00:53:30.559 --> 00:53:34.920
that were slow to process compared to, you know, setting

793
00:53:34.960 --> 00:53:39.679
an email compared to modern digital methods, though in the

794
00:53:39.880 --> 00:53:45.119
end effective enough to generate positive identifications from Illinois and

795
00:53:45.199 --> 00:53:49.519
California within days, So like they were doing.

796
00:53:49.320 --> 00:53:50.079
The damn thing.

797
00:53:50.679 --> 00:53:58.039
They're working together, working together, instead of measuring dicks. Portland

798
00:53:58.199 --> 00:54:01.239
is central to Nelson's story to a degree that most

799
00:54:01.519 --> 00:54:06.719
national retellings understate. Four of his twenty two confirmed victims

800
00:54:06.800 --> 00:54:12.039
were killed in Portland, Beta Withers, Virginia, Grant, Mabel Fluke,

801
00:54:12.440 --> 00:54:17.440
and Blanchemier's, making Portland the single city with the highest

802
00:54:17.440 --> 00:54:22.079
concentration of nelson murders anywhere on his route, ahead of

803
00:54:22.119 --> 00:54:26.119
San Francisco and Kansas City that had three each, and

804
00:54:26.199 --> 00:54:31.440
Winnipeg with two confirmed victims. With the Seattle murder of

805
00:54:31.519 --> 00:54:36.039
Florence Monks added, the Pacific Northwest accounts for five of

806
00:54:36.159 --> 00:54:40.760
Nelson's confirmed victims, roughly a quarter of the total, a

807
00:54:40.840 --> 00:54:46.119
significant regional concentration for a killer known for his mobility,

808
00:54:47.440 --> 00:54:50.840
And like, what the fuck do you have against us?

809
00:54:50.920 --> 00:54:57.159
Like why, I don't know, And to be honest, as

810
00:54:57.480 --> 00:55:01.800
is the chase with so many serial killers, there are

811
00:55:02.000 --> 00:55:10.159
unfortunately suspected but unconfirmed victims. And that's a little bit

812
00:55:10.360 --> 00:55:13.599
of what I want to talk about in the Patreon bonus.

813
00:55:13.960 --> 00:55:20.159
So you know, if you are really intrigued by this case,

814
00:55:20.280 --> 00:55:25.320
that's something to look forward to a reason to join,

815
00:55:27.199 --> 00:55:29.159
or if you're just like sick to death of this

816
00:55:29.519 --> 00:55:35.039
creepy fucker, also totally understandable, you.

817
00:55:35.000 --> 00:55:36.760
Could still join, just don't listen to it.

818
00:55:37.360 --> 00:55:41.599
Yeah, there's other content there, you know, if you just

819
00:55:41.639 --> 00:55:43.360
want to support us, that's cool too.

820
00:55:44.159 --> 00:55:44.920
What ifs.

821
00:55:46.239 --> 00:55:50.480
But that's all I have for both parts one and

822
00:55:50.519 --> 00:55:55.000
two of Ugh, this this guy Earl.

823
00:55:55.800 --> 00:55:59.480
I was definitely wondering if there was a chance like

824
00:55:59.559 --> 00:56:03.880
he had murdered more yeah people than they knew about

825
00:56:04.760 --> 00:56:05.199
mm hmm.

826
00:56:05.920 --> 00:56:12.320
And I will say that, I well, you're just gonna

827
00:56:12.320 --> 00:56:14.199
have to You're just gonna have to listen to the

828
00:56:14.239 --> 00:56:21.960
Patreon bonus for that. Yeah, yeah, but I'm subscribed.

829
00:56:22.800 --> 00:56:23.000
Yeah.

830
00:56:23.880 --> 00:56:29.000
I do firmly believe that there are likely other victims

831
00:56:29.039 --> 00:56:35.000
that were not included in the body of our two episodes, damn,

832
00:56:36.000 --> 00:56:40.280
which is unfortunate because it's already just you know, it's

833
00:56:40.320 --> 00:56:44.400
a lot of people that I mean, their lives were

834
00:56:44.519 --> 00:56:47.519
ended and then the people that loved them, their lives

835
00:56:47.599 --> 00:56:55.480
were just irreparably changed, and I can't even imagine, I mean,

836
00:56:55.679 --> 00:56:59.159
and we talked about this so many times. The victims

837
00:56:59.199 --> 00:57:02.360
were so frequently discovered by you.

838
00:57:02.239 --> 00:57:06.639
Know people, the people closest to them, and yeah, the

839
00:57:06.800 --> 00:57:08.559
husband's the kids.

840
00:57:08.920 --> 00:57:13.000
Because they were killed inside of you know, their homes

841
00:57:13.320 --> 00:57:17.360
or inside of other properties that they owned or you know,

842
00:57:17.480 --> 00:57:21.400
worked at. It's like, really, that's the only thing that

843
00:57:21.480 --> 00:57:22.079
makes sense.

844
00:57:22.199 --> 00:57:23.599
It just adds.

845
00:57:24.039 --> 00:57:28.000
It's just salt in the wound in this case because

846
00:57:28.519 --> 00:57:30.039
it's already just so ugly.

847
00:57:30.800 --> 00:57:32.639
But should we do.

848
00:57:32.639 --> 00:57:36.519
Some terror about it? And maybe, yeah, maybe we'll get

849
00:57:36.559 --> 00:57:39.360
a pretty tarot card and that'll make us feel better.

850
00:57:40.079 --> 00:57:43.880
They're all pretty so that Yeah, I mean the words

851
00:57:43.880 --> 00:57:45.159
aren't always pretty.

852
00:57:44.840 --> 00:57:49.119
But yeah, no, I mean, you know, it gets complicated

853
00:57:49.159 --> 00:57:49.679
at times.

854
00:57:50.679 --> 00:57:52.480
All right, well, let's.

855
00:57:52.239 --> 00:57:52.920
Taro it up.

856
00:57:54.440 --> 00:58:00.039
Wow, vibes are being transferred. I like it.

857
00:58:00.039 --> 00:58:03.360
It That was weird and then you like moved and.

858
00:58:03.280 --> 00:58:04.400
It zoomed in on you.

859
00:58:06.599 --> 00:58:10.519
Yeah, it felt like the vibes got closer in that moment.

860
00:58:11.239 --> 00:58:11.639
They did.

861
00:58:14.320 --> 00:58:17.599
Okay, I've got them laid out in front of my

862
00:58:17.679 --> 00:58:25.400
keyboard as per usual when we're remote. So is there

863
00:58:25.639 --> 00:58:28.760
like a letter or a number that lines up with my.

864
00:58:28.800 --> 00:58:30.280
Keyboard that's calling to you?

865
00:58:31.440 --> 00:58:36.840
N N Okay, Oh interesting, Okay, here we go.

866
00:58:38.440 --> 00:58:43.559
Oh it's a cute card. Okay, Well, like we said, yeah,

867
00:58:43.559 --> 00:58:46.920
oh oh yeah, it's another one of those that we've

868
00:58:46.960 --> 00:58:51.639
gotten quite frequently. Seven of swords. Okay, the little weasel

869
00:58:51.679 --> 00:58:55.800
eating an egg. He was a little fucking weasel. Yeah

870
00:58:55.880 --> 00:58:58.440
he was a weasel. Well he was a big weasel.

871
00:58:59.079 --> 00:59:03.119
Yeah, it's an Olympic short tailed weasel.

872
00:59:03.920 --> 00:59:04.360
Okay.

873
00:59:04.559 --> 00:59:09.000
So this is really interesting though, because obviously weasels, they

874
00:59:09.000 --> 00:59:14.920
have sort of a persona, are easily right, weasely exactly.

875
00:59:16.400 --> 00:59:23.960
Our keywords in the Little Book are cunning, trickery, sneakiness, deceit, resourcefulness, strategy,

876
00:59:24.159 --> 00:59:26.559
and stell like all of that.

877
00:59:29.679 --> 00:59:31.079
Shut the fuck up.

878
00:59:31.360 --> 00:59:34.280
Okay, so this takes me back to part one. I

879
00:59:34.400 --> 00:59:37.840
just glanced at the Little Story because you know me,

880
00:59:37.960 --> 00:59:40.280
I'm like, sometimes I like to just get to the

881
00:59:40.320 --> 00:59:46.039
big book interpretation. But we have I love the stories. Yeah, well,

882
00:59:46.119 --> 00:59:49.000
and we have to read it this time. We literally

883
00:59:49.159 --> 00:59:50.320
have to we m.

884
00:59:51.960 --> 00:59:52.519
Weasel me.

885
00:59:55.360 --> 01:00:00.360
Listen, everybody's got to eat. It ain't my fault. And

886
01:00:00.400 --> 01:00:04.079
Papa Robin decided to fly off at the same time.

887
01:00:05.559 --> 01:00:06.480
Opportunity.

888
01:00:07.639 --> 01:00:15.280
Yes, but remember he was orphaned. Parents died like very

889
01:00:15.280 --> 01:00:20.679
close together. But I agree it works two ways.

890
01:00:21.119 --> 01:00:22.760
Yeah, ooh, creepy.

891
01:00:23.519 --> 01:00:26.960
It goes on to say. See, I wouldn't call that

892
01:00:27.000 --> 01:00:30.760
a wise decision. I know they're not going to want

893
01:00:30.760 --> 01:00:33.440
to hear this, but when you think about it, this

894
01:00:33.519 --> 01:00:34.440
one's on them.

895
01:00:35.400 --> 01:00:38.639
No, that's what we were saying about the victim blaming and.

896
01:00:40.119 --> 01:00:50.199
The look that's how nature works. It's opportunistic. Wow, And

897
01:00:50.400 --> 01:00:53.159
I know an opportunity when I see it.

898
01:00:54.719 --> 01:00:58.239
That is so him.

899
01:00:58.320 --> 01:01:02.800
Anyway, if I didn't wipe these eggs, somebody else would have.

900
01:01:04.039 --> 01:01:07.599
Anybody could have been waiting in the leaves, still and

901
01:01:07.719 --> 01:01:13.079
silent as death, watching that nest all afternoon.

902
01:01:13.079 --> 01:01:17.599
And he did that. He like stalked and waited for

903
01:01:17.880 --> 01:01:18.360
Oh my.

904
01:01:18.400 --> 01:01:23.840
God, anybody could have deftly climbed the tallest tree, swung

905
01:01:23.920 --> 01:01:28.920
out onto that rickety bow, and dove neatly into the

906
01:01:29.039 --> 01:01:33.480
nest cup without so much a scuffing a single delicious egg.

907
01:01:34.679 --> 01:01:37.519
So what if I got there first? Don't blame me

908
01:01:37.719 --> 01:01:40.599
for playing the game and winning. So what do you

909
01:01:40.639 --> 01:01:41.440
want me to do?

910
01:01:42.400 --> 01:01:48.480
Starve? Oh my god, that was like so his mindset too.

911
01:01:48.559 --> 01:01:51.920
And I've not We've read this before for sure, and

912
01:01:52.000 --> 01:01:55.519
it like it has related to all these dudes who kill,

913
01:01:55.599 --> 01:01:59.679
But like that, every single word was so spot on

914
01:02:00.079 --> 01:02:02.079
for him specifically in what he did.

915
01:02:03.239 --> 01:02:08.920
Yikes that truly truly.

916
01:02:09.519 --> 01:02:10.960
Wow, he's a weasel.

917
01:02:12.440 --> 01:02:24.960
Okay, seven of sorts here we go. Keywords are uncertainty, illusion, impetuousness, stealth, cunning,

918
01:02:25.239 --> 01:02:28.440
and strategy. So we did draw this in the reverse.

919
01:02:28.519 --> 01:02:31.719
So this is when I think it's really good that

920
01:02:31.800 --> 01:02:33.519
we have like the Big Book to kind of give

921
01:02:33.599 --> 01:02:38.639
us a more nuanced interpretation between the upright and the reverse.

922
01:02:41.599 --> 01:02:43.239
Interesting, okay, m m.

923
01:02:44.239 --> 01:02:48.639
Some decks, including the Writer, Waite, Smith, Aquarian, and Gilded Taro,

924
01:02:49.280 --> 01:02:53.400
show a man carrying away five swords, leaving two stuck

925
01:02:53.440 --> 01:02:57.239
in the ground behind him. When this card appears, it

926
01:02:57.519 --> 01:03:01.159
suggests you're facing a challenger problem. I must use caution

927
01:03:01.360 --> 01:03:03.199
to overcome potential danger.

928
01:03:04.960 --> 01:03:08.960
Girl, you in danger? Yeah, I was kind of like

929
01:03:09.000 --> 01:03:11.960
the people who did get away, like they they were

930
01:03:12.039 --> 01:03:17.599
using caution and ended up getting away from him. Yeah.

931
01:03:18.079 --> 01:03:24.119
Honestly, when the seven appears reversed, it can mean either

932
01:03:24.239 --> 01:03:29.400
you're behaving impetuously or that you're overly cautious and afraid

933
01:03:29.400 --> 01:03:33.000
to act. I mean, I think we know which way

934
01:03:33.039 --> 01:03:35.679
that one falls. I think we know which way that

935
01:03:35.800 --> 01:03:40.199
cookie crumbles. I think it's the first one. It can

936
01:03:40.280 --> 01:03:43.880
also represent coming clean about a mistake and trying to

937
01:03:43.920 --> 01:03:45.639
make restitution.

938
01:03:46.360 --> 01:03:50.800
Which not something that he did. Did he He never

939
01:03:50.880 --> 01:03:51.559
admitted it.

940
01:03:52.440 --> 01:03:55.400
I mean, there was kind of an early admission, but

941
01:03:55.559 --> 01:03:59.800
like he very quickly reversed course and just was like,

942
01:03:59.840 --> 01:04:03.039
oh no, it's all lies. All these people are wrong.

943
01:04:03.280 --> 01:04:07.360
And it's interesting because it's like the exact opposite of

944
01:04:07.400 --> 01:04:08.000
what he did.

945
01:04:08.920 --> 01:04:10.159
Yeah, pretty much.

946
01:04:10.199 --> 01:04:12.480
Just what he needed to do. See, he needed taro.

947
01:04:13.360 --> 01:04:14.559
Yeah he really did.

948
01:04:15.199 --> 01:04:20.480
Yeah, because remember initially, when first asked about the murders,

949
01:04:20.840 --> 01:04:24.400
Nelson bluntly told a reporter, I only do my lady

950
01:04:24.480 --> 01:04:26.199
killings on Saturday.

951
01:04:25.840 --> 01:04:28.639
Nights, the dad joke. Yeah.

952
01:04:28.880 --> 01:04:31.480
But then he immediately was like, oh no, I didn't

953
01:04:31.480 --> 01:04:31.719
do it.

954
01:04:31.800 --> 01:04:32.639
I didn't do it.

955
01:04:32.679 --> 01:04:33.639
All of them are wrong.

956
01:04:34.199 --> 01:04:36.800
Oh yeah. I mean, but that was like also saying

957
01:04:36.840 --> 01:04:38.800
he didn't do it, because I think I picked. I

958
01:04:38.840 --> 01:04:40.559
thought he was saying, like, I go to the club

959
01:04:40.599 --> 01:04:43.840
and I kill it with the ladies, like, yeah, Saturday nights.

960
01:04:44.000 --> 01:04:46.280
I mean, I don't know that clubbing was so much

961
01:04:46.320 --> 01:04:47.960
a thing back in the nineteen twenty.

962
01:04:48.440 --> 01:04:50.119
That's what I thought he was saying.

963
01:04:50.840 --> 01:04:54.320
Yeah, it does seem like even that you could kind

964
01:04:54.320 --> 01:04:57.239
of read that in more than one way. I see

965
01:04:57.239 --> 01:05:00.920
what you're saying. In a reading about money, be careful

966
01:05:00.920 --> 01:05:06.159
of get rich quick schemes, gambling, or dubious endeavors.

967
01:05:06.159 --> 01:05:09.039
Like killing people and taking their money and jewelry and

968
01:05:09.159 --> 01:05:14.519
selling their clothes and then getting caught right Literally, the

969
01:05:14.599 --> 01:05:18.960
reverse seven can represent deception or leaving yourself vulnerable.

970
01:05:19.719 --> 01:05:23.039
Sometimes it suggests you may have gained through or are

971
01:05:23.159 --> 01:05:28.440
considering underhanded means. I would say, I mean to put

972
01:05:28.440 --> 01:05:32.519
it mildly. If the reading is about your job, this

973
01:05:32.679 --> 01:05:36.280
card can warn of dishonesty or deception in your workplace.

974
01:05:37.079 --> 01:05:40.719
Perhaps you'll need to separate yourself from a situation, stay

975
01:05:40.760 --> 01:05:43.480
open minded and flexible so that you can respond to

976
01:05:43.599 --> 01:05:48.960
changes quickly. It can also mean taking advantage of someone else. Yep,

977
01:05:49.199 --> 01:05:53.079
all that, I would say professionally, Like all.

978
01:05:52.960 --> 01:05:56.519
These women they owned the properties and were like renting

979
01:05:56.559 --> 01:05:57.599
out rooms and.

980
01:05:58.480 --> 01:06:02.920
Yeah, yeah, I mean almost all of these women. It

981
01:06:03.000 --> 01:06:05.800
was like either they were renting a room or they

982
01:06:05.880 --> 01:06:09.159
ran a boarding house, they were selling a home something

983
01:06:09.280 --> 01:06:12.880
like that. There was like so few of the victims

984
01:06:12.960 --> 01:06:15.320
didn't fit that exact.

985
01:06:14.840 --> 01:06:19.199
Profile, like they're just trying to work man your deception.

986
01:06:20.719 --> 01:06:23.639
In a reading about love, The reverse seven can mean

987
01:06:23.760 --> 01:06:28.599
apologizing for a mistake or injury. Perhaps you've betrayed, hurt

988
01:06:28.800 --> 01:06:30.199
or manipulated someone.

989
01:06:31.000 --> 01:06:35.239
That's kind of an interesting thing that it's literally says injury,

990
01:06:35.360 --> 01:06:38.639
and that was like one of his last words. Yeah

991
01:06:39.559 --> 01:06:43.280
that's so true. Oh my God, Like and he forgave,

992
01:06:43.800 --> 01:06:49.119
forgave the people who injured him. Yeah, God, blow me.

993
01:06:50.920 --> 01:06:54.800
However, this card can also show you assisting a partner

994
01:06:54.920 --> 01:06:57.960
through a challenge or warning him or her against a

995
01:06:58.079 --> 01:06:59.320
risky course of action.

996
01:07:00.320 --> 01:07:02.159
That kind of reminds me of like the warning that

997
01:07:02.199 --> 01:07:05.519
went out to everyone, right, like, hey, don't be alone

998
01:07:05.519 --> 01:07:07.239
in a house with a man ever.

999
01:07:07.280 --> 01:07:14.880
Right never a Yeah, there is an extra excerpt I

1000
01:07:14.920 --> 01:07:19.280
would just like to note it is from his holiness

1001
01:07:19.800 --> 01:07:25.719
the fourteenth Dalai Lama. Tragedy should be utilized as a

1002
01:07:25.760 --> 01:07:30.320
source of strength, no matter what sort of difficulties, how

1003
01:07:30.400 --> 01:07:35.400
painful experiences. If we lose our hope, that's our real disaster.

1004
01:07:36.679 --> 01:07:39.880
I like that. I know we always do.

1005
01:07:39.960 --> 01:07:44.159
We always feel we let that fill us up because.

1006
01:07:44.559 --> 01:07:47.360
We hear about all these families and people and they

1007
01:07:47.400 --> 01:07:51.199
go through this horrible shit. Yeah, and we're like, oh God, like,

1008
01:07:51.320 --> 01:07:54.199
how are you gonna survive after that, and then we

1009
01:07:54.239 --> 01:07:59.559
get this beautiful quote I know, and actually I don't know.

1010
01:07:59.599 --> 01:08:01.400
I'm trying to think of a way to say this

1011
01:08:01.760 --> 01:08:05.320
about like what I have, and it's it's kind of

1012
01:08:05.400 --> 01:08:08.679
a short one. It's not like the length of a

1013
01:08:08.719 --> 01:08:13.280
full episode, but the Patreon bonus like it just shows

1014
01:08:14.400 --> 01:08:18.880
like truly the length of the tentacles with a case

1015
01:08:19.239 --> 01:08:24.880
like this, and in some respects it shows like kind

1016
01:08:24.920 --> 01:08:28.039
of the darkest aspects of this that like we haven't

1017
01:08:28.119 --> 01:08:32.279
really even touched on. And then on the flip side,

1018
01:08:32.600 --> 01:08:37.159
like what feels like kind of the closest thing to

1019
01:08:37.560 --> 01:08:41.399
sort of like a silver lining in a way, And

1020
01:08:43.840 --> 01:08:47.000
I don't know, I've just this one. I mean it was,

1021
01:08:47.159 --> 01:08:51.239
it was. It was rough to research and certainly a

1022
01:08:51.319 --> 01:08:52.600
challenge to write up.

1023
01:08:52.640 --> 01:08:57.079
But I think in some ways, like some of the

1024
01:08:58.640 --> 01:09:02.520
aspects of it that it were the most intriguing to me.

1025
01:09:02.920 --> 01:09:06.800
And then that kind of like in the end writing

1026
01:09:06.840 --> 01:09:09.960
about it like made me feel like kind of hopeful

1027
01:09:10.079 --> 01:09:10.600
in a way.

1028
01:09:12.920 --> 01:09:13.359
I don't know.

1029
01:09:13.840 --> 01:09:15.520
I got to the end and I was like, this

1030
01:09:15.600 --> 01:09:19.399
is just like I simply can't like this cannot this

1031
01:09:19.520 --> 01:09:22.279
episode even part two, Like this is not going to

1032
01:09:22.359 --> 01:09:25.039
be three parts, because I don't think we have three

1033
01:09:25.079 --> 01:09:30.399
parts here. But I was like, there's just there's just

1034
01:09:30.439 --> 01:09:33.159
these things that like didn't quite fit in that, like

1035
01:09:34.119 --> 01:09:36.319
I couldn't not make this part of.

1036
01:09:37.800 --> 01:09:41.119
The overall experience. I guess, I don't know. I don't know.

1037
01:09:41.359 --> 01:09:47.279
I just I'm excited about this Patreon bonus just because

1038
01:09:47.279 --> 01:09:47.840
of me too.

1039
01:09:48.279 --> 01:09:48.479
Now.

1040
01:09:48.600 --> 01:09:53.680
Yeah, well, and once it's over and like we kind

1041
01:09:53.720 --> 01:09:56.319
of we we got our palate cleanser with the taro,

1042
01:09:56.640 --> 01:10:00.640
and it feels like this ended where it should in

1043
01:10:00.680 --> 01:10:01.520
a lot of ways.

1044
01:10:01.840 --> 01:10:06.359
You know, mm hmm, that's perfect all things.

1045
01:10:06.800 --> 01:10:11.239
It's like you planned it, I know, right, Well, I

1046
01:10:11.479 --> 01:10:14.319
literally texted you and I was like, okay, based on

1047
01:10:14.520 --> 01:10:19.399
current page length, like this feels like it may be

1048
01:10:19.479 --> 01:10:24.359
two parts. But sometimes when it's like this dense and

1049
01:10:25.239 --> 01:10:28.399
like it's this dark, sometimes those end up going really

1050
01:10:28.479 --> 01:10:31.039
quick when we record because we sort of feel like,

1051
01:10:31.079 --> 01:10:32.960
oh my god, like what do you even say?

1052
01:10:33.039 --> 01:10:33.720
Like that?

1053
01:10:33.880 --> 01:10:36.520
I guess this isn't one of our more comedic episodes.

1054
01:10:37.640 --> 01:10:41.960
Yeah right, but like this one, I felt like, I

1055
01:10:42.000 --> 01:10:45.079
mean thankfully it played out that there there was a

1056
01:10:45.119 --> 01:10:47.359
lot for us to just kind of like try to

1057
01:10:47.439 --> 01:10:51.199
lighten things up. With a little bit, and I felt

1058
01:10:51.199 --> 01:10:53.560
like our discussions were good.

1059
01:10:53.920 --> 01:10:58.319
It like adds value to Yeah, I think so, I

1060
01:10:58.359 --> 01:11:02.960
hope so yeah. Otherwise just running my fucking mouth, you

1061
01:11:03.000 --> 01:11:03.279
know what.

1062
01:11:03.319 --> 01:11:06.439
But that's allowed, so they can't stop us.

1063
01:11:11.079 --> 01:11:17.399
Well, my goodness, should we do that? Faye? Yeah? Yeah,

1064
01:11:17.600 --> 01:11:22.520
probably have a creepy day. We'll see you next Thursday.

1065
01:11:23.279 --> 01:11:26.600
But not you, earl, like this is the end.

1066
01:11:26.520 --> 01:11:32.680
Of the road. Never Nelson, never now said the new

1067
01:11:32.760 --> 01:11:42.479
Never Bundy, I know, never Clark, never Clark, or Virgil Virgil.

1068
01:11:42.279 --> 01:11:47.960
Wilson, Yeah, Virgil Wilson. I mean, this man had so

1069
01:11:48.079 --> 01:11:50.560
many aliases it's wild.