The Columbia Edgewater Country Club Car Bombing

0:03 The roof of the buick was blown completely off and hurled several feet away. Shrapnel and twisted metal scattered across the parking lot as smoke, dust and debris filled the air. Smith was killed immediately. The injuries were catastrophic, leaving no possibility of survival. Within moments, the quiet routine of the country club had been transformed into one of the most shocking crime scenes Portland had ever seen. Hi Cassie, Hi Caitlin. Hi creepy people, Oh hellou? And also the guy that just honked outside my window?

0:48 How I didn't hear it? Dang it, honks and sides. This is PNW Hansen Homicides, where we chat about true crime, the paranormal, and old. Things spooky in the Pacific Northwest. Or I'm telling you it never gets old for her. It doesn't, And if it gets old for you, I frankly don't give a shit. Yeah, Frankly, my dear, I don't give a damn Yeah, because I just need you know, I need everything, I need, any little crumb. Just keep me podcasting, okay, just give it to. Me, all right. Yeah, the universe is kind of like throwing us a lot of other bullshit so.

1:33 A little bit, A little bit. Well, speaking of the universe, we do a little tarot reading at the end of every episode for a little deeper insight into our topic and. Actually a spoiler alert. I have a new deck. I mean we've had it for a while. I just don't think that we've ever used it in a reading on the show. So I feel like we used it one time, did we? Yeah? Because I remember maybe we got the on with like a drink on it and I didn't know what the drink was. It was like a sprit a Capari sprits. Yeah like that. Wow, I know my pay times is random.

2:13 Yeah, No, that was like that felt like new old memory unlocked. You're welcome. Look at you remembering. Shit, I couldn't tell you what episode it was or oh god. No, Well you know what? Have we done a couple hundred of them at this point, so, I mean. Hard pressed. Yeah, do we have any business or should I just get right into it? I don't think we. I don't know if we have any new Patreon subscribers. Probably not since the last time we chatted. Yeah, not to my knowledge. I was gonna say, we just we just talked about a couple in our last episode, and yeah, so.

2:55 We're all today with shout outs. If you want, I hope us to say your name out of our mouth, you can join our our Patreon and uh, it's really fun. Well put, I was gonna say, oh, whatever else we do, and then I can't think of it. You get a welcome card, you get a free mini tarot reading. It's a whole thing. It's a whole thing. AD free episodes very important, definitely. Yeah. On the morning of Thursday, April twenty first, nineteen fifty five, the parking lot of the Columbia Edgewater Country Club looked exactly the way it was supposed to on that overcast day in Portland. Cars came and went, engines idled, doors opening and closing amidst the light rain and fog of the early morning hours, but nothing about the morning particularly stood out. By afternoon, though the air along the Columbia River remained heavy and humid, the partial sun breaking through the clouds was an early indicator of spring returning to the city.

4:04 Oh, we were just talking about that is the winter done yet? I know. It feels like winter is still coming. I think we're actually we're entering the part of winter where it starts to behave the most like winter. Yeah, and I have feelings about it, but we just we don't. We simply don't have time. I smell snow, I exactly. Oliver Kermit Smith referred to in many newspaper accounts simply as Al Smith for inexplicable old timey newspaper reasons that I can't quite understand.

4:44 What was his name? His name was Oliver Kermit Smith, and. They called him Al Okay, maybe I don't know, Maybe he didn't want his name used. I don't know. Well, at this point he didn't really have a say in the matter. But uh, strange. It wasn't a nickname that he went by that I could find. I spent a. Few minutes looking into this because I was like, why am I seeing Al Smith confusing in some of the reporting? Yeah, it's very confusing. And so what what the Google fox told me was that it's very likely that some of the early reporting it was just recorded incorrectly or it's just an inconsistency. And then some of the reporting that followed in the very early days just like mimicked that.

5:38 They were like, oh, they've already fact checked this. There's like multiple articles that I came across at one point or another that used that, like what feels like an alias? Wow, it's very strange. Okay, I know what happened though, So his name is Oliver. So what if he's like, hey, I'm all and then they're like ow okay, al yeah, fault it. Honestly, that's a more satisfying theory than what my Google search returned. They were just like, I don't know, I don't know why they would have said that, but it's parroted back because newspaper reporters were sometimes a little sloppy, fake news.

6:20 Right, I was like back then and probably still. He was a thirty five year old Portland resident and regular presence at the club. Very latched. Uh, I mean, to my mind, I don't. I am not a member of any country club. The country club, yeah, even though I said it like country club. But there are now so fancy that I've seen on. Tapery fancy mm hmm. A quiet and mild mannered man and prominent attorney, with nothing about his demeanor that day to suggest he was anxious or in any way distressed. He was not known to be involved in active disputes or really any type of controversy. I think a lot of the reporting really stepped ever so gently around, like basically falling just short of calling him like, you know, kind of a boring guy.

7:14 Yeah, like, yeah, it was. It was interesting. I feel like the nineteen fifties were definitely a different time, but it was like even they were like this man, like nothing interesting about him, or it's just like he's just like a man in his middle age, like settled into a career in community but okay. He reportedly called his wife just minutes before leaving the club where he'd been playing jin Rummy amongst friends, to tell her that he was headed home. Home was a craftsman bungalow at sixty four twenty six Northeast Alameda Street, common to homes built in the neighborhood of the era. So it's actually really really cute. I'm I want me a craftsman bungalow.

8:05 I was gonna say, don't even like I don't really know what a bungalow means, like I've heard the word. I don't know. Honestly, I should have been able to write up a whole other case in the time since I started and ended this one, but things like Craftsman Bungalow. Really, they really have me leaning into a. Very hard detour. The amount of time that I spent looking into the architecture of this singular building, which. Has very very little to do with the case. Alarming.

8:46 Yeah. Hey, man, you what does it? You go? Where the dopamine is? I don't know? Yes it is? Yeah. Hey, here's the thing is I tell the hyper focus to engage, I can't tell it what to engage with. Unfortunately. Yeah, wouldn't that be a superpower? Oh my god? Can you imagine? I'd be unstoppable. Oliver was reportedly the last to leave the stag party held at the club that night, And just for a reference, because stag party, I think is I think back then it was a more common term, and I think now, like across the pond, it's still a term that's used more frequently. It's basically a bachelor party. Oh.

9:33 I was going to say some kind of man party. He's some sort of man party, a man gathering. It's a man gathering. He unlocked the door to his nineteen fifty two Buick and sat down behind the wheel as he prepared for the drive home. What a square car. Yeah, honestly like a Buick though for real, no offense, it's no offense. I love me a square car, trust me. I'm like, if I could have like a station wagon, an old one, that would be just fantastic. That's the dream to you. Yeah, I'm pretty sure it's come up on the podcast before.

10:14 It's because it looks like a hearse without being a hearse. That I believe you are correct. I believe that has come up before, and as as per usual, my response has not changed. I I'm not like a crazy I'm I'm not all about my car, but. I do need something a little a little bit sexier, a sexy little grocery getter. Hey man, the driver makes it sexy, you know. Oh wow, honk if you're horny. He unlocked the door to his nineteen fifty two Buick and sat down behind the wheel. As he prepared for the drive home, a violent blast erupted from beneath the driver's seat, tearing through the car with extraordinary force. Holy shit balls, that I was like, not expecting that ex that. Yeah, I aim to please, Like.

11:17 I felt a blast inside of me. Oh my gosh, not you know, it just like was we need a break no, no, but no, it's I know, it's been a while since we've had one that was I don't know, there's something about suck. I don't know. It's very scary. It's very scary. And I can only imagine in the eras and you know, locations where like bombings of any sort have been you know, really prolific. I can only imagine what it's like to try to live your life. That is not the case at this.

11:57 Point in time in Portland, so it's actually all the more shocking. But we'll get there, okay. The roof of the buick was blown completely off and hurled several feet away. Shrapnel and twisted metal scattered across the parking lot as smoke, dust and debris filled the air. Smith was killed immediately. The injuries were catastrophic, leaving no possibility of survival. Within moments, the quiet routine of the country club had been transformed into one of the most shocking crime scenes Portland had ever seen. Jay Raymond carskadon a golf buddy, as well as the ex Chief Criminal Deputy District Attorney say that ten times fast, I dare you, Oh, I had also been I don't know, don't do it, it's not worth it. Had also been invited to attend that same stag party, simately had declined. He said Smith didn't normally attend sag parties and wasn't all that interested in attending, but that his wife had urged him for Karskadon.

13:13 The sudden loss seemed surreal, but another equally awful thought haunted him. If he had attended the party, he himself would have perished in the awful explosion, as he would have been riding home with Kermit. And I'm gonna, yeah, I'm going to refer to him largely throughout this as Kermit because I think it is so endearing. Kermit. Yeah, Kermit. I know that you said that was his middle name or was that his last name? I can't remember that was his last name, middle name, Okay, I know, I just thought it was. It's very very I don't know, it's so cute, it's very sweet.

14:00 I just picture him, you know, riding along in his buick with Miss Piggy Kurmie Kurmie. I feel so fucking bad for his wife, like the guilt, but I like. I'm one hundred percent oh, unless she had something to do with it, it's hard to say. I mean, honestly, this uh Carskadon character. He's all of. A sudden going for a real sympathy plea. Huh hmmm, I'm just kidding. That's terrible. He had nothing. Oh oh, I was like, well, that's like what I was thinking, Like, Oh, how convenient that you didn't go to this. I know. Well, that's why I put it in at the beginning. I was like, I'm gonna put this in because it's like, it's really really sad. It was one of those things where like there's a lot of like these really short flips or excerpts from people that the papers interviewed, and they're really like you can just tell like people were so upset. But yeah, that's literally why I put it at the beginning, because I was like, I want everyone to think, Hey, what about the buddy who was supposed to go with him? Hey, yeah, now I'm like immediately feeling bad for the wife, Like, but you know, just just since we don't know anything yet, right, that's an appropriate reaction. Police and fire crews arrived quickly

15:35 and secured the area as investigators began their work. Early on, authorities noted that the explosion did not appear consistent with a mechanical failure or accidental cause. The damage pattern suggested something else. It suggested otherwise that. Would be an insane accident, like they're just a card to exp just for no reason, flowed so. Violently that it immediately kills the driver and only passenger. Yeah, I mean, thankfully no one else was there to be injured.

16:17 But like, how awful. I'm thinking about that one, the one episode that you did. What was it? Yeah, Barry Berry who love Yeah, lost his leg? Yes he did, Yeah, he lost his leg. The force of the blast, its upward direction, and it's timing pointed investigators towards the possibility of a deliberate act. In nineteen fifty five, Portland was not accustomed to this kind of public violence, a car bombing being exceedingly rare. While murders occurred, they were typically domestic shootings or barroom altercations, not carefully engineered explosions in public spaces. That's pretty intense.

17:07 Yeah, that's how I was, Like, there's a word that I'm like, yeah, intense obviously, you know, just accidentally like drop off a bomb and someone's car, you know. Like, yes, exactly that's such an intentional thing. News of the bombing spread rapidly because you know, it's a fucking bombing. Did it blow up? Yeah, it blew up. Oh my god, I'm just saying. Dominating local radio reports and newspaper headlines. Just two days later, the story had reached national wire services and made the front page of the Oregonian. Investigators soon determined that an improvised explosive device had been placed beneath the driver's seat and wired directly into the ignition system. Oh damn. The design ensured that the bomb would detonate the moment electrical current flowed. It was a method that required forethought, mechanical skill, and an intent to kill without warning. So again, it just goes back to this is like very clearly a deliberate act. As detectives began reconstructing mister Smith's life, they initially searched for external enemies. They examined possible business disputes, gambling connections, labor conflicts, and any ties to organized crime.

18:39 But Kurmy was clean. None materialized, So none of that stuff. Because literally all the papers it seemed like that they could talk about was like how he's just like this very like all American normal, like average dude. Yeah. I mean he's a lawyer, okay. Got a wife and kids. Like he's, you know, a lawyer into his career. You could be a lawyer, yeah, I mean you could have you you could have some enemies as a lawyer. That's that's for true. He was also a country club guy, so I mean, yeah, he's got golfing buddies. He didn't even want to go to the stag party.

19:29 He's like, was Smith his real name? That general? Yeah? Very generic generic, thank you, that's the one. Yeah, you were close, you were you were getting there. I was almost there. I can remember Barry and the tarot card we pulled years ago, but I can't remember the word generic. It's fine, hey, listen. There's no rhyme or reason, just spiciness. Smith's finances were modest, his employment history stable, and friends described him as dependable and low key, with no known enemies. But for someone without established enemies, it sure seemed like someone had been perhaps trying to kill mister Smith, but very.

20:15 Very obviously yeah. Well more obviously. With no outside motive emerging, attention turned inward toward his personal life. In the months preceding his death, Kermit had recently remarried his wife, Marjorie May Roberts Smith. The couple was first married on August twenty second, nineteen fifty two, but according to Marjorie, had been separated for nearly three years prior to their remarriage on February fourth, nineteen fifty five. HM. I mean, I know it works out for some people, but I would just say, just you know, yeah, don't go backwards, never go backwards.

21:00 Yeah, And you know, they had a child together, so I can understand, especially back then, I'm sure the pressure to like, you know, stay together for the kids. Yeah. I couldn't find anything that provided any significant substantiation of her accusation, but in their initial divorce proceeding, she had accused him of basically verbal abuse. And having slapped her. I don't know if that was Yeah, I don't know if that was like a singular occurrence or what that I mean, So that I feel like I feel like I have to mention it just because it's like, you know, to lay out all of the information.

21:52 Right, you know, what goes on behind closed doors? Exactly exactly just weeks prior, been attacked outside of his home, resulting in a broken nose when a bottle had been. Bashed about his head. Jesus. When police questioned him about who the attacker might have been, he replied Wolf, and apparently there. Was some confusion. The policeman was like, you were attacked by a wolf, right, and he was like, uh no, actually, I will give you his full. Name because he was indeed a man, not a wolf. Okay, got it.

22:33 It was like his last name or something or exactly maybe his first name. That'd be real weird. But Fox Moulder, Yeah, I like where your head's at. But no. While there hadn't been any evidence against Wolf in this prior attack, it certainly made him a compelling possible suspect in Kermit's murder. Now, what no one knew is that the assailant had held a thirty eight special with the intent to kill the poor man and had lost the nerve, which is so confusing to me, because how do you go with a gun to kill someone and then you lose the nerve and decide to just beat them?

23:19 Maybe a bottle work? Like what maybe are you looking? Are you looking for a noisier way to do this? I don't know. My thought is he had to like get the liquid courage up there and yeah, and then he's like, well, now I'm here with this empty bottle. Yeah. I didn't. I really I couldn't quite make sense of it. There wasn't really any description of it that I can recall seeing beyond just a bottle. It never said, like, you know, a liquor or a beer bottle, because that that was kind of yeah, that was my thought too.

24:02 It was like liquid courage because you're about to try to like shoot someone, and I would hope that you at minimum feel a little conflicted about killing another human being. But hard to say. Interesting. The Smith's relationship had been unstable for years, you know, because they were separated for three years and at the time of his death had only been back together for like a couple months. Yeah, so marked by the significant separation, then divorced before an abrupt reconciliation. To neighbors and acquaintances, the remarriage reportedly appeared sudden and puzzling. There was no public narrative of renewed romance or reconciliation. Instead, the reunion seemed quiet, transactional, and emotionally distant.

25:01 Like just like like I said before, kind of you don't know what goes on behind closed doors, so like you don't know what they were talking about or doing, like you have no idea. Right, there were some people that had some ideas, but also who exactly was this wolf character? Right? Am I right? I mean a wolf? Or I'm wanting you to tell me? Are you not gonna Oh, I'm definitely gonna yeah, okay, cool, Yeah, No, he figures very prominently throughout the rest of the story, so fear. Not woo, we need to know. Financial records soon became central to the inquiry. Investigators confirmed that Smith's life insurance policy was active at the time of his death, and that Marjorie Smith had been restored as beneficiary following their remarriage.

25:52 H beneficiary Beneficiary. Insurance company representatives cooperated with law enforcement, providing documentation showing the policy's reinstatement payment was immediately suspended pending the outcome of the criminal investigation, removing any immediate financial benefit. Uh oh spaghettio. As detectives examined the timing of the remarriage more closely as one might yeah, they interviewed friends and acquaintances who had observed the couple during that period. Several described the reunion as emotionally restrained and lacking the outward signs of genuine reconciliation, rather than renewed closeness. Witnesses recalled distance and importantly tension, just like, why.

26:50 Would you both agree to that? Like, what are you getting out of that? I know why, at least one of them would agree to that. I'm seeing a reason for one of them. Possibly, I'm wondering about the other one. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I mean stay together for the kids. It was a real strong motivation. And then there was something else that I think worked out to be a real strong motivation as well. Friends of the couple would testify that the reunion was not driven by affection. Marjorie had spoken openly about her dissatisfaction with the marriage and her desire to leave Portland behind closed doors. She was already envisioning a different future, one that did not include her husband.

27:39 She got lucky. Yeah, I know, look at that convenience. Weird, weird that you would re marry someone and be like, but actually I don't really see them as part of my future. Right, maybe they'll just like die or something, you know, yeah. Or somethings began piecing together the scope of Marjorie Smith's relationship with Victor Lawrence Wolf. I knew it. I was like Victor's a wolf. Victor Lawrence Wolf a forty five year old electrician who lived in a residential property owned by Missus Marjorie Smith.

28:21 Interesting he brought his family to Oregon after his farming operation went busted in nineteen thirty nine. They were living in Kansas at that time. We're not in Kansas anymore. Nineteen thirty nine saw a lot of people leaving Kansas and some of the surrounding areas because that was just following the height of the dust bowl. Oh that was bad. It was all bad. Not that I went through it or anything, but I heard no. No, I mean people were literally starving to death. Yeah, very very very very.

29:03 Scary times for people living, you know, in I think that was kind of Midwest anyways, it makes sense like historically his migration with the family. That all like that tracks. He worked odd jobs, but also began acquiring rudimentary skills of the electrical trade. Handy. Around the holidays, he'd served as the Santa Claus for the Christmas party at Missus Smith's rooming house, her rental property. Oh, I saw Mommy kissing Santa clause. Oh, thank you for connecting those dots for me. You're welcome.

29:44 Witness statements placed the two together frequently in the months leading up to the bombing. Wolfe's background drew immediate interest. He had mechanical experience, access to tools, and sufficient technical knowledge to construct a electrically triggered device. Several witnesses reported seeing him near the Smith residence and vehicle during the period when investigators believed the bomb was installed. Shit, dude, not looking good. It's not looking good. Yeah. Bad, Sannah, bad, very bad Sannah. When questioned, Wolfe initially attempted to minimize the nature of his relationship with Marjorie, as one does when they are having an illicit affair with a woman whose husband was just literally blown to pieces.

30:36 Seriously, I don't know nothing about that. I don't know that. I never heard of him. Over time and across multiple interviews that account shifted detectives documented inconsistencies in his explanations regarding his movements, his access to Smith's car, and his knowledge of explosives. Because at first he definitely tried to downplay that, eventually, under sustained questioning Wolf confessed, upon investigators revealing their discovery of detonators stuffed into the heater vent of his vehicle, his involvement becoming pretty quite.

31:17 Clear, super duper. It was like you did it? Had those be in there? Yeah, never seen those before my life. That's oh, we're used to like hide something, but I guess it's really like who would look in there? But who wouldn't look in there? If you're police. Investigating and you're like you kind of quickly became suspect number one, like you were suspect number one in the first attempt to harm him, so strange. According to summaries of his statements, Wolf admitted to constructing the bomb and installing it beneath the driver's seat of Smith's Bewick. Wolf described selecting the placement carefully and wiring the device into the ignition system to ensure detonation at startup. He stated that the act was not impulsive, but planned over time, which is kind of a duh.

32:18 You can't really impulsively build a bomb and exactly, yeah, like painstakingly connect it to the electable system. Dollar, Yeah, that's not really how this works. That's not how any of this works at all. In fact, Kermit carried a combination of life insurance policies valued at approximately twenty twenty one thousand dollars. Okay a lot for back then, Yeah. A substantial sum. In nineteen fifty five, my lovely husband, when he was proofreading my notes, happened to look up the conversion. For today's stellars. I know.

33:00 It was like literally the only note he made. The people have. To know, the people need to know, equivalent to over two hundred and forty thousand dollars today. Yeah. So that's a good amount of money. It's a good chunk of money, depending on where you live, Like that's enough to buy a house in cash. Not where we live. I was in a shithole. Maybe not in Portland. No, not even a shithole in Portland. Could you know pay that? I don't think so. The policy named Marjorie as the beneficiary, which we know. Records show that the remarriage had taken place shortly before the bombing, restoring Marjorie's beneficiary status. After their divorce, Wolfe said that as soon as she was married again to Smith, she denied wolf her favors until he should kill Smith. According to the play, she used her vagina as a weapon. Uh huh, But I mean the specific phrasing in the nineteen fifties news article about this rather blunt wow, like everybody knew what they were saying, Like, yeah, she held out on him until he would kill her husband.

34:26 Wow. Sex manipulation is hardcore. Mm hmm. This in the parentheses in the bunny ears on this old timey newspaper article that I'm about to send you a picture of. That is how the case was very widely known. Do you want to read the headline. Love slaves says widow behind plot don dund love slaves. Wow. Yeah, a lot of the reporting was really focused on that angle. I could see that. I mean, it's scandal scandal, very very very scandalous. Oh salacious. That's a good vocab word. Thank you to use it, right, Yeah, no, a thousand percent. I don't think that I can even fathom a better usage of the word.

35:17 I'm clutching my pearls. Yes, that's right, you are, and your faith in yourself. Oh, I've got the vapist. What do you need to drink? A Minjulu? Now none of these people are Southern, but it's just of the time. Okay, this extramarital relationship, while marked by secrecy and emotional fixation, was hardly clindestine because, as you'll recall, before the actual bombing, Wolf was named as the person Kermit thought most likely attacked. Him with a bottle outside their home.

36:00 Oh yeah, okay, wow, so not exactly a secret. No, he said at the time to officers that interviewed him in the hospital after his attack, that I think he likes my wife. That's my wife's love slave Rythar. According to later testimony, the two spoke openly about abandoning their current lives and starting over together in Alaska, their shared dream homestead location, a place they viewed as distant enough to escape scrutiny and consequences. Oh weird, here's the thought. You were already divorced. I mean he was, I believe at the time. She wasn't.

36:45 I think. So I'll get into why. Okay, I'm going to get into why, because there's there are some other pieces. Okay, okay, I'm just like she was free, like I don't understand. Yeah, she was. She was totally like you re married. The Mayan show Jenny whosel Wolf implicated Marjorie Smith as a co conspirator. He told investigators that discussions about the insurance money and plans to leave Portland were frequent and explicit. While accounts varied slightly in wording across reports, Wolf consistently maintained that the murder was a shared plan, motivated by financial gain and the promise of a new life elsewhere and sex. Again.

37:35 Yeah, I mean yeah for him for Suresey. One of the statements that Wolf made, and he, I have to imagine probably made it repeatedly to some like effect, in some form or fashion, whatever you want to say. He said that Marjorie specifically wanted to kill him, not just because of the life insurance, but also because she worried that if she were to just divorce Kermit again, that he would gain custody of their daughter. Okay, I don't know, take that with a grain of salt, because it's coming from Wolf, her co conspirator, is you know, the murder. Both were arrested and charged with the murder.

38:20 The obstacle to the future Marjorie Smith and Victor Wolfe had supposedly envisioned was Kermit Wolf possessed the technical ability required to build an explosive device. According to Wolf, he had shown up to the Smith family home on a Wednesday afternoon, just the day prior to the bombing to install the deadly device. Marjorie conversed with the neighbors to try to avert their attention, and their supposed cover was wolf putting together a swing and other playground equipment for the couple's daughter, Susan's birthday, aged three at the time.

39:02 Is it is he working on the Is he doing stuff to the car? Yeah? No, that's that's when he put the bomb and there. Their big plan was he's putting together swing set. What does that like if someone sees you doing stuff to the car, why wouldn't you just leaves fixing something in the. Car, you know, because that maybe that would have looked like more suspicious and they didn't want somebody to say, oh, yeah, I saw him working on the car right before the murder occurred. I don't mean, okay, are you say? I guess okay, that makes sense. I was just like looking at it from the point of view of like he's over there, people are gonna see him doing stuff to the car.

39:43 Probably, I don't know, yeah, no, I mean like your head's in the right place for sure. Okay, but that does make sense because he doesn't want to be associated with the car. Got it exactly exactly. Crawling beneath the vehicle, he mounted the bomb under the driver's seat and wired directly into the ignition circuit. When the key was turned, the circuit would close. On April twenty first, it did. So. Keep in mind that their cover story involves Marjorie and Kermit's three year old daughter at the time and her supposed birthday gift. Kermit died.

40:25 The bombing occurred on Thursday, April twenty first of nineteen fifty five. Their daughter's birthday was April twenty eighth. Oh that is so sad. I didn't even think about that part, Like when you mentioned I kind of thought maybe they met up her birthday too. I don't know. Yeah, fuck, how can the car didn't explode when he started it to drive it? Are you gonna go over that? I'm not, because it got super technical and I don't know how he got from wherever he was gonna go or like you know, obviously he was at their home or the office wherever in the car and then drove to the country club. And then it was like, okay, so then when he left the country club.

41:13 Maybe I don't know how debated it with the remote things that I don't know. That's interesting. I have no idea that was sort of a piece of it that I was like, I don't really have enough technical knowledge to explain that piece of it, Okay, And it's frustrating to me because I know, I know that they did this in the family home, So why didn't it explode when he left the family home? Yeah, that is huh. The thing about it is too, there's like not necessarily like as much of the actual court records that would be like digitized for me to be able to like go and read through.

41:59 So I really am relying on. The newspaper articles of the time and like people, you know, basically like reporting of the time to like explain how they did it. And there's certain things that are super consistent throughout all of it, where they say it was mounted underneath the driver's seat, it was wired directly into the ignition circuit, and it was set so that like it couldn't accidentally go off, but that it would go off specifically when he started the vehicle. And I'm like, so, then how does that h I almost was thinking like, is there like some way that he was able to set up the mechanism so that like the first time he started the car it wouldn't blow up, but then the second time that it would.

42:52 Maybe it was obviously like something like that. Yeah, And I just don't know enough about like the technical like aspect of that to really explain that fully. And it's so frustrating. All of the information that's out there, like surrounding the. Case is like it kind of describes it in the same way, and it doesn't really explain like how he set it up so that like obviously that car had to leave the family home. They didn't want it to be wired to blow up while he was still in the driveway or in the garage at their family home. So like I want to know that piece of it. Yeah, me too, So curious, Okay, bomb experts let us know.

43:37 Right As the investigation had progressed, detectives faced a significant challenge. Much of the physical evidence inside the vehicle had been destroyed by the explosion itself. As you might expect, feels fair, the force of the blast obliterated components that my other wise have yielded fingerprints, tool marks, or even wiring fragments. What remained, combined. With particularly Wolfe's statements, however, was enough to establish intent and method with confidence. They were like, yeah, I don't think we have to wait and worry and wonder about this one.

44:26 So I guess there was that. God, can you imagine if it went off just like randomly while like she a home or something like, were you not just ridding yourself thinking about that until it left? Like I mean you should have been like how long. You said there was a day before? Yeah, yeah, yeah, So like obviously hopefully she knows, like, yeah, obviously, don't get in the car, like for any reason, even if you're not going to start it. What if she like forgot karma? Yeah, but I know, I know, well sometimes karma is a bitch.

45:11 Investigators concluded that the bomb had been deliberately placed beneath the driver's seat, positioned to direct the force upward into the cabin. The placement suggested an understanding of how to concentrate the blast while reducing the likelihood of accidental detonation. The wiring connected to the vehicle's ignition system was designed to trigger the device when electrical current flowed. Contemporary reporting emphasized that the bomb could not have detonated accidentally and would have required both mechanical skill and advance. Access to the vehicle.

45:52 So it's like all of these parts and pieces where it's like Marjorie couldn't have done this herself, and the fact that wolf had been seen the home the day prior near the vehicle, it all just it's very neat. Yeah, how do we know she's not an electrician bomb expert? She wasn't. Just saying I have some other fun facts about Marjorie and electrician she was not. In court, physical evidence from the vehicle was presented, alongside expert testimony regarding the bomb's construction, financial records detailing the insurance policy, and the couple's remarriage, witness statements describing the relationship of the defendants at their respective trials, and of course Wolfe's confession. If he hadn't confessed, I think there's a really good chance that the outcome of their respective trials could have been potential very different, hard to say. The defense strategies reflected the limitations of the evidence and really ultimately of science at this point in history. Wolfe's attorneys acknowledged his role in building the device, but sought to contextualize his actions through emotional dependence and manipulation aka.

47:24 Love slave, sex slave mannipulation, manipulation. Oh boy, if you aren't saying a whole lot right there. Marjorie Smith's defense emphasized the absence of physical evidence tying her directly to the bomb, arguing that she had never handled. Explosives or placed the device. But you know that's not the only way to have culpability and a murder. During the trial, jurors were instructed that under Oregon law, criminal responsibility for murder could extend beyond the person who physically carried out the act, encompassing planning, encouragement, or intent really important in the eyes of the law.

48:14 Wolfe had purchased dynamite from two different stores near Malala, but the pair had traveled together to Ridgefield in Washington to buy the detonators. Okay, well, couples day a. Little right, just a little romantic road trip. Why do you say a couple's date date night is date night? Trying to say, yeah, yeah, there we go. On the way, they had stopped for a picnic lunch. Oh, and that's where I know. It's unbelievable. It's unbelievable. And that's where he'd cut a bouquet of pussy willows for her.

48:55 Pussy willows because he wasn't getting any of that pussy. I was like, I was tempted to put in my notes pause for ninety seconds for Cassie to process, and last I was like, this is gonna take a minute. Did he really collect pussy willows? Uh huh, that's so funny. But do you know, like they're an actual like plant. Oh yeah, I've heard of that. I don't actually say, I don't really, I don't know what they look like. I had AI generate a couple of like bouquets, like pictures of bouquets for me, just for reference, because I'm like, that's him getting you flowers.

49:39 Okay, oh okay, I've seen those before. I see. Yeah, they're beautiful looking. I mean, they are pretty, but like, it's not what you think of when you think of a bouquet of flowers. I will say that. No. I mean I guess if they were her favorite or whatever, that's cool, Probably not right. I don't know that they were. But the bouquet had of course been uncovered when the home had been searched. By law enforcement that very bouquet had been uncovered. And they know this because they drove to Ridgefield, Washington and looked for where the pussy willows had been cut.

50:26 They did they and they matched them. That is some hardcore detective work right there. I don't know how you do that period, but in the nineteen fifties, I'm like. It with all the forensics they had. Yeah, I'm just I'm just gonna have to take their word for it. But I mean the fact that they show up to the house and they find a vase full of pussy wilves, and like, that's such a key component of the story in relation to picking up Debton. Yeah, I feel like, you know what, just just just. Go with me, you know.

51:08 Victor Lawrence Wolf was convicted of first degree murder and sentenced to life in prison. I think that was the best possible outcome for him, because at this point in history, if he had actually been sentenced to death, he would have been sent to the gas chamber. Oh shit, dude, Yeah, sh So there's that if he had been put to death. Ultimately, however, the jury found the evidence insufficient to prove that Marjorie Smith met the legal threshold as essentially a conspirator what and she was acquitted what.

51:52 I am furious. I'm outraged. I will say, I think it is really tough, especially in nineteen fifty five, to meet the burden, the threshold for proving that there was sort of a conspiracy to commit murder between these two. I feel like a lot of what they have is very damning, but a lot of what they have is based on like kind of second third hand witness testimony or like ultimately just very circumstantial. But the pussy willows, you know, like the vibes are there, but I don't know that it feels like they have anything super concrete. And here's the other thing is that having researched particularly some of like this isn't the old timiest.

52:50 Of cases that I've researched, but. The public's appetite for justice or vengeance was nearly insatiable. However, in the case that a woman might be convicted, should she happen to possibly face the death penalty, a lot of people simply could not stomach. That They're clutching their pearls. Yes, I do think, I do think this is one of those cases where they're like this is a child's mother. Yeah, in this case, I you know, I wasn't there. I didn't sit on the jury. I certainly wasn't there when they were, you know, installing the bomb. But to me, it certainly seems like Marjorie they she done did what they said she did? Wow, and that was somebody's father. Yeah, like around her birthday, so close to her birthday, a.

53:57 Week before her birthday. In time, the headlines faded, the parking lot was repaired, the Columbia Edgewater Country Club resumed its routines, but the case never fully disappeared. If I had known the story when I visited in a professional capacity, I'm sure I would have looked at the place very differently. The Columbia Edgewater Country Club. I have been there, and at one point I had photos and videos that I took when I was out on it was like a job walk for a project bid. Wow. Okay, I'm gonna have to see if there's any possibility in like either somewhere buried in my camera role or maybe even a dropbox that I can recover anything that I might have taken that day.

54:54 Obviously I don't have photos of the crime scene, folks, Not right, my own personal but not. Like there would be much to see anyway. But no, but yeah, I mean it's kind of interesting because I did sort of get an eerie vibe. On the property. And it's still a country club. Yes, it's basically just a it's a golf club, is okay. I guess I was thinking like it would be something totally different now, but that I mean that makes sense. Yeah, yeah, but it is. Yeah, it's I don't know. It was weird because I knew nothing about this case and when I first looked at when I first came across this case, I looked it up and I went, that sounds so familiar. And I was like, I am just positive that I was out there on a job walk like a few months ago. Can that be right?

55:51 And I looked it up and I was like, you have got to be kidding me. That's crazy, just because it's cool to have been some place that you know, you feel like you have a personal connection. Not I don't know, saying that it seems or feels cool feels icky in a way, but it's like, you know, it's just people can understand it's a historical site. I'm not looking at it like ooh, murder porn. You know, I just look at it more as like this is sort of a historical site. Yeah, you know what I mean, Yeah, I think so. Decades later, the Columbia Edgewater Country Club car bombing remains an infamous Oregon crime, remarkable not only for its brutality, but for what it revealed about mid century anxieties surrounding marriage, money, and morality.

56:50 Preserved in court transcripts, newspaper archives, and historical collections, the story endures as a stark reminder of how calculated islands can hide behind the appearance of ordinary lives. A man turned to key in his car on an ordinary Portland morning, and a carefully constructed lie exploded all around him. Damn dude, which I feel like is ideally, in terms of, you know, an audio narrative, the perfect place to end this. And I'm not going to do that because I have a little bit more and I think you'll understand why I didn't want to leave some of this stuff out.

57:35 Kermit was a veteran of. World War Two wow awarded both a Purple Heart and a Bronze Star throughout his service. Dude Dude had a purple. Heart kind of like a big deal. From what I gather, I don't have any colored hearts or stars from my service. Is that when you get like injured in the line of duty or something, is that what that's for. I don't know what the criteria was in nineteen fifty five, but so eligible actions injury must result from action against an enemy, action from friendly forces, or as a result of foreign terrorist attack.

58:18 Basically, you have to. Have been found not fit for duty if in the case of a concussion, it says for greater than forty eight hours, the injury must require treatment by a medical officer. So this is all a lot of things where it actually outlines more things that mean you are disqualified than it does specify anything above and beyond about what qualifies you for this award. I really would be so interested to know what were the what was the like qualification back in nineteen you know, forties, nineteen fifties, because I know that a purple heart like you whip that out.

59:09 You're not buying a drink in town. Right, it's a big deal. Yeah, he's the primary victim in this case. But I couldn't help but feel a tug at my heart strings for the couple's young daughter, in particular, beyond the obvious pain of losing her father at such a young age, indeed one where she may have either very few memories of her father or none at all. She may not have any actual memories of her father. She may only remember what she was later told. Yeah. Once Marjorie's trial came to a close with her acquittal, a family court battle ensued. Marjorie's son, Gregory, was in the custody of his father, her first husband, during the trial, but that custody arrangement seemed perhaps less acrimonious.

1:00:04 Oh, she had another husband. Okay, she had been married before, So he dodged a bomb, sure did. Ellen High Tower Kermit's sister had come to Oregon upon learning of her brother's murder, arriving shortly after Marjorie's arrest had taken place. In the interim, Susan had been taken to a neighbor's home, then retrieved by a maternal aunt that lived locally, before ultimately being given. To the care of the High Towers. No one had objected to the high Towers taking Susan home with them to California, including the aunt who had temporarily taken her nor her maternal grandmother, both of whom were Oregon residents. Susan remained with the high Towers at their Santa Clara County home until missus High Tower initiated proceedings requesting to be appointed guardian of young Susan. Though Marjorie appealed to regain custody, it appears the outcome was guardianship or day to day custody being awarded to Kermit's sister Ellen. So they basically the High Towers they took over caring for Susan in nineteen fifty five, and the guardianship decision came down in nineteen fifty seven.

1:01:36 Oh man, So she was with him for two years. H dang and so young. So young. And then just to think about, I realized that, you know, probably the neighbors were people that she knew. But then she's handed off to her aunt, and then she's handed off to her other aunt, and so the only sense of permanency or normalcy after this horrific thing that happened, and how much of that she understood, I can't imagine. It was much. Truly such a sad way for a man to lose his life and for a child to lose their father.

1:02:19 But based on everything that I've read, it seems like Susan remained in the custody of her paternal family with the High Towers. Wow, that's amazing. Yeah, Ellen high Tower. Kermit's sister. Spoke to newspapers, and I believe there was an excerpt from court testimony where she said, I have spoken to three different individuals that all said Marjorie approached them either about killing Kermit themselves or that she spoke of her desire to have Kermit killed.

1:03:02 Geez. She just spread it all over town. Yes, it was not a well kept secret, her affair, her desire to have Kermit die. Geez. So why didn't she you might have said, why didn't she get the custody of the kid, Like did she have to give her up because of the whole court thing. Or because of the trial? Essentially? Okay, but she was found not guilty. Correct, And I thought, well, you know, probably once she's acquitted, she's going to be given her child back, and that would, I think, typically be the most appropriate. However, because none of the maternal family even tried to keep her there, Nobody said, hey, you can't take her. The high towers, you know, maintained custody of her, and she was so young, and basically what they were saying is that Marjorie does not seem like a fit parent. Ellen seems like a fit parent.

1:04:05 And yeah, so wow, so this whole thing and she was like worried about losing custody of her daughter and she doesn't even get her anyway in the end, like you could have just fucking moved away. Yeah, you dump bitch, Yeah honestly, wow. Yeah. I mean, unless there was anything that maybe didn't make the papers in terms of like legal proceedings with custody, but for this to be the decision that was made by the courts in nineteen fifty seven, I think, given the full set of circumstances, one of the things that it it kind of in a way, and they had to be really careful in how they worded the decision.

1:04:50 I think, regardless of whether or not she had had any involvement in the murder of her husband and Susan's father, it seemed pretty clear that there was just almost overwhelming evidence that Marjorie had had this you know, illicit or inappropriate relationship with another man. And I think the courts felt like, why would we send her back to that? Yeah. I don't think. Infidelity is or should be necessarily grounds for losing custody of your children. But if you, you know, wrap that up in a murder plot as well, Yeah, that's where things get a little bit different. Yeah.

1:05:39 I can't imagine like uprooting her after two years too, Like that would be so sad. It's such formative years. I think that was probably for the best. Yeah, there's no way that wasn't sad for like really almost everyone involved. I mean, it's no matter what happens, somebody was going to have this heart wrenching, life altering experience related to this case. Like there's no good way for this end, even in relation to the custody. It's like somebody's going to be left broken hearted. Wow, okay, should we do some terror?

1:06:25 Yeah? I think we said we do terror on every episode, so yeah, let's do it. Oh okay, yeah, yeah yeah, ooh. We should tell him what deck it is. It's the housewivestero, a domestic divination kit and it's very like style, yes, very vintage nineteen fifties style. I cannot wait for you to see some of the old timey newspaper clips, because she very much looks like what you would think a you know, I mean, she's not like twenty two, but she's very much like a young like little housewife.

1:07:10 Okay, and he wolfy yep, wolfy is. I feel as though it may be accurate. I feel as though this affair may have been may have been for the sole purpose of the murder. Well, she she was in her bad boy era. She yep, you're kermit, like. Very fifties businessman. I can't remember what I mean. Definitely, okay, Yeah, that was definitely his vibe. He was like roughly middle aged ish. He's an attorney, definitely like in a more you know, settled place in his life. He's not somebody that you're gonna suspect is out you know, cowboy in around town. Yeah, okay, Although in the nineteen fifties, if I've learned anything from mad Men, huh, I don't know.

1:08:04 I don't know, if you know, nineteen fifties lawyers were the same as like ad executives on Madison Avenue or not. But I have to assume kind of a little bit maybe on a lesser scale. Yeah, Okay, I'm going to operate under that assumption. That's what I'm that's what I'm picturing. That's the vibe I think. Yeah, I think he was more of a stand up guy. Okay, send me the vibes sending Caitlin magic through my fingers through the computer screen. Now, oh my gord, I can feel a Yeah you can because we're magic. Okay, I just have to say too, like, would you look at this? It's like very much like a it's like a checkered apron. Yeah, like a kitchen floor or like a even wallpaper back.

1:09:05 Then, oh my god, it's it's very of the time. Now the evergreen question where in this sort of a semi circular. Arch middle right spe shape okay. Middle right? How far right? Like middle ish middleish? Okay, I think we're not going far right? Okay, no, never we have the eight of Wands. Okay, you know, I kind of had a feeling we were gonna get wands because that's like the fire element.

1:09:47 Oh interesting, And I couldn't tell what all the little there was a bunch of little things on it. They're really see what they were. They're like brooms and mops. Oh fairy fifties housewife. Yeah, is there a vacuum on. There were vacuums invented back then. I think vacuums did exist. There are none on this particular. Card, but interesting. Yeah, okay, So our keywords are action, excitement, new experiences, and urgency.

1:10:29 It seems like they're like the wife and the Wolfe's relationship kind of maybe a little, maybe a little. There's definitely a vibe there. When the aid of wands appears, you can expect your life to speed up big. Time or blow up. Oh no, this card suggests lots of action and excitement coming your way. This is the carpe dim card. Ooh that's okay, Hold on, what does carpe dim mean? Don't remember? It's kind of a seize the day type of a vibe. But I can look up what carbe dim actually means.

1:11:09 Carbe dim is a Latin phrase meaning seize the day. Nice. Something stuck in there? I know, hey, you guys smart Caitlin, I think she's still here. That's just kind of very eerie. Yeah to hear that because his life ended so quickly, I mean kind of what people that you said quickly? Okay, okay, was it was it? Not? Quick? No? It was quick? Oh I was like I thought you said it was like instant. You're like, why whatever you've put into motion now takes off at a rapid pace.

1:11:51 Yeah, I would say so takes off too. Mm hmmm yeah, uh whootah. The eight may also indicate a whirlwind. Trip that's like, oh my god, Okay. This card shows a busy period in your life when you feel, oh my god, I'm dying. I need you to understand that this is like quite literally physically what happened to this man? And no, yeah, this card shows a busy period in your life when you feel catapulted towards something you desire.

1:12:34 Dude, even though like the word the meaning of like the actual sentence doesn't like super fit what happened to him, but like just the word the little. Yes, yes, yes, yes yeah, because it's my understanding that his body was literally catapulted from the vehicle and ended up a couple of behind the rear bumper. Oh my god, I was you know, I was like thinking about that when you were talking about it, But I was like, I literally can't ask because I don't want to know, Like I can. I think we can all imagine what happens when someone blows up.

1:13:18 Yeah, even though you may be a bit overwhelmed, you're excited and inspired confidence all will turn out well. Take a few risks, break out, try new things, and let go of what no longer suits you. Wow, I just feel like this whole this card is like just like what sheet, what was in like her mind like, Oh, I just need to get rid of this. I need to start a new life. I need to like seize the day, get rid of this baggage seriously. In a reading about money, you may experience rapid gains or sudden opportunities, rapid gains like from the life insurance in Yeah, perhaps you feel a sense of urgency in financial areas and may need to make split second decisions.

1:14:13 Wow, even though this thing was kind of like planned, been planned for a while, but like you feel like in her mind it was like it needs to get done right. I feel like the urgency is what I pick up on for sure. In a reading about work, the Upright eight suggests a time of inspiration when things happen fast and you have to make quick decisions. Your career moves forward. Rapidly and you have to hustle up. You have to hustle to keep up This card can also represent job related travel. Well, I'm thinking of their their their hit job together.

1:14:57 Yeah, travel, have a picnic. I'm like, oh my god, Okay, this next part just wow. In a reading about love, the upright eight points to a passionate and exciting romance. It can indicate a sudden love affair that sweeps you off your feet, or a hasty marriage, or maybe both. Oh my god, yeah she did have a hasty marriage. I mean a hasty remarriage. I w yeah, yeah, and sweeps you again, like sweeps you off your feet. Like that's another like it sweeps you off your feet. And the brooms wow, oh my gosh. Okay, so is there anything else on that, Like just the pictures on the card that like remind you of something from the case just curious, Not particularly because it's literally just a singular woman flying on a broom and she's surrounded by a bunch of other flying brooms and mops. That's actually very interesting though, yeah, because it's like she's like bye, yeah, but she's like flying away. She's like and people, you know, usually put witches on brooms and they think of witches is like these terrible creatures who will like kill their men, you know, right, Like that's kind of interesting, it is, okay, So I'm gonna tell you the other little extras that like didn't fit in neatly. But I have to say

1:16:31 the part that kind of got me that I didn't it didn't really like resonate totally right away, was your career moves forward rapidly and you have to hustle. To keep up. Two things. I think I'll start with the one that reson that like links to that specifically. Uh. Marjorie was asked if she thought she might write a book about the case, having already written part of another on gems given her experience in gemology. Oh heavens no, she is said to have replied. Attorney Bruce Spalding said, you don't want to write a book, but you want to say that you have nothing to hide, followed by the interjection of co Council, you stood before the world naked.

1:17:22 Spalding again, Yes, this case is nothing to write a book about, but you'd be willing and glad to talk about it at anytime. Marjorie replied, Yes, Spalding again, Marjorie, isn't that kind of a writer. With a laugh, whoa oh, why she's more of a gem, like a scientist. She was kind of like a scientist. Is that what a gem? I don't know how strict. Someone who works at like a jewelry store. Uhh, Yeah, that's more of a jewel race store thing. Okay, that makes more sense. So I'm like, she didn't seem like a woman in stem to me. So I do understand why someone would be willing to talk about it and like get the information out. But it's a very different thing to write a book and like re traumatize yourself and then go on to make money for it.

1:18:19 Like I feel like people would. Have just oh, back then, that would have been such a hot button thing. Yeah, So I could totally see, like even if you know, if she wasn't the best person, like Okay, So I I recently watched a documentary about a case that I've heard a lot of other people talk about that generally, I respect their opinions, and I think in the strictest legal sense, the burden is on the state they did not prove beyond a reasonable doubt, at least to a jury of her peers, regardless of what we might think of the level of a mental processing of that said, jury, it reminded me of this more modern case where it's very much a woman who is uh.

1:19:23 Seems to have been very caught up in. Sort of the glitz and glamour of being a defendant, and while that may not make her very likable, it does not make her guilty. Yeah, yeah, that is true. However, the public's fascination with true crime as a genre, even back then, it was far less like widely accepted. But okay, so I'm just going to read to you this was literally in the newspaper. This was reported like it was news in the nineteen fifties.

1:20:09 Oh boy, okay, I can't wait. After all the craziness of this case, I really couldn't figure out where. To put it, And now I did just Now. For breakfast Friday, she ate a hearty meal, one egg, orange juice, bacon, toast, coffee, and my vitamin pill. Yeah, okay, cool story. I would call that a hearty, hardy breakfast, like maybe a normal for. A housewife in the nineteen fifties. I think that was a pretty hardy breakfast. It's not just like a half a greape fruit and coffee exactly. Yeah. I was really blown away because especially care well. Okay, so especially after the verdict, people we're asking like, you know, how do you feel?

1:21:02 And you know, I. Feel like that's pretty typical, and so that's where kind of some of that buzz comes from. But I was like, I feel like what she had for breakfast isn't what particularly sparks my intrigue. But do you Yeah, like unless it was like particularly interesting, like she like a bunch of mealworms or like, that would be the problem. Maybe, yeah, news. But something unique, something interesting, and I she blended her breakfast and snorted it down her nose. Yeah, okay, I want to know that. That's on my strange addiction. Oh no, oh no, that's don't do that.

1:21:55 Listen. I'm not here to yock anybody's yum, but like, don't don't don't do that. I feel as though, yeah, I was just going to say, I feel as though nine out of ten doctors will not recommend. That, and the one that does might there might be a problem there. Yeah, yeah, might not be a real doctor. That doctor also had some questionable recommendations in twenty twenty. I bet, oh, oh my job, that was it. I just I couldn't believe the public fascination with and who knows, maybe that was put in the paper and absolutely zero fox were given.

1:22:41 But I feel as though. If they included that in the article, you know, post sent you know, post trial, because I mean that was literally after she was acquitted, weird. I don't know. I get the sense that probably there was some sort of public sentiment that like that might be interesting and that makes me deeply, deeply sad. How did they even know because they asked her. Yeah, it was a direct quote. She told them what she had for breakfast. That is so weird to ask somebody like right after they've been acquitted, So what did you have for breakfast?

1:23:24 I'd be like, I just it makes me think of like, I feel like it's far more interesting when they ask, you know, when they share what people's last meals were, but like, clearly this is not her last meal. It's interesting to look at retrospectively. I don't I just don't know why anyone gives the fuck about it and it was included. In the first place. Okay, so should we say goodbye to the lovely people because I think that there's a dog about to peep. Hey, don't don't out me.

1:24:08 Yeah, no, between between my sixteen year old senior dog and you. It's definitely you that's gonna pee on my carpet. I mean, I'll be right over. You're like, you never know so bad, I'll be right there. I'll be right there. All right, this feels like only fans, like a very niche. Content coming to you. Sam. All right, let's go, oh boy, have. A creepy ass day. We'll see you next Thursday. I did it.

1:24:49 No, listen to the smart Caitlin. She's hard to find. I know that bitch is missing. Smart Caitlyn. Let us no if you see her