Innocence & Injustice - The Steve Titus Story

0:00 Probably not exactly the birthday plans that either of them had envisioned, but they understood that a serious crime had occurred, and they wanted to help if they could. Steve was polite and cooperative throughout the entirety of these interactions, even smiling in the mug shot taken of him at the time. "It's probably what I would do to frame it." "It's funny you should say that because, because of the celebratory nature of their evening up to that point, the pair even asked if a photo of the two of them could be taken." "Hi, Kelsey." "Hi, Caitlin." "Hi, creepy people."

0:43 "Hello, hello." "Hello, what?" "I'm pretty sure he did something really weird with my eye because some lashes are falling into it." "Oh." "So if I was like that, it's fine, don't mind me." "That's why." "I'm used to being in a podcast and not on a video." "It's true. Yeah, it's a little bit of an adjustment, and I have a lot more lash going on right now. I'm very blonde. It's a real adjustment. If you'll say I super glued my eyelids together." "It kind of looks like it." "Does it?" "Oh no." "I'm kidding. She looks so pretty." "I mean, I look okay, but I'm all done up for our engagement show later. So." "Yeah, and I really brought it down on my side just to make her look even better."

1:35 "Oh my god." "Yeah, because, um, Cassie and I are engagement show." No. "I won't be in these photos. Just this camera here right now." "All right, fine. I was going to invite you, but whatever." "If you're new to our creepy corner of the world, this is PNW Hunts and Homicides, where we chat about true crime, paranormal, and all things creepy in the Pacific Northwest, and also occasionally mango sparkling wine." "In our show." The show that we're doing right now and presenting for you, we do a tarot reading at the end of every episode for a little deeper insight into what we're talking about for the day. "Yeah, it's true.

2:24 We'll do it again today." "Yeah, we do it every time." "Yeah, mostly." "Listen, there's always an exception to the rule." "Yeah, usually for like bonuses, which we have on our Patreon." "Sometimes we do bonusy things." "Oh man, we do bonus episodes. What else do we do, Caitlin?" "We're working on getting them videos for every episode. Add free." "Add free they already have." "Yes, just to be clear." "Oh my goodness, do we have any businessy business to get to, do you think?" "I'm an announcement. It's hot today." "Yeah, it's really hot." "And it was hot yesterday, and it went to the beach, and it was a perfect beach day at Oregon." "It was like one of those rare, very rare warm beach days. It was great." "Yeah, that sounds so lovely." "Hey, no, come to Oregon, come to the coast." "Or don't, because there's already too many people here, but you know, whatever, do you?"

3:24 "Sorry, I made it like really enticing, I didn't mean to. I thought we wanted our creepy friends to come hang out." "We do what?" "Damn it." "All right." "If you live at the coast, I would not be opposed to inviting me to a house party." "Oh, bonfire." "Yeah, type thing." "Yeah." "Are you ready?" "Yeah, I'm ready." "Okay." "Freak my heart." "She's not ready, but here we go." On October 12th of 1980, at 7.22 PM, a 911 call was placed from a secluded road south of SeaTac, the Seattle airport.

4:05 But SeaTac, if you're nasty. "Yeah, yeah, yeah." "We are." "Yeah, of course." "Of course." Reporting to the dispatcher that a young girl had just been raped, she said that her attacker had instructed her to stand in front of his vehicle until he drove away following the assault. She was terrified that he would shoot her because he'd made no attempt to obscure his face or hide his identity. "Oh, wow. Bulzy." "Pretty Bulzy." "But yeah, I could see how she would come to that conclusion that's fucking terrifying." "He's like, just walk away from the car. Nothing else bad will happen." "Wing-wing, no, Jenudge, Saint-O' War." "When she was able to confirm he left the immediate area, she ran to a hillside home. The humble home was situated on her right-hand side just a very short walk away, which was lucky considering Sunset was over an hour prior to her making that short trek. So, it's guard-outside." "Yeah." "It belonged to Paul Liston. He was a retired carpenter who was the last holdout in the area. Everyone else had sold the property to the airport." "Oh, it was going to be part of an airport expansion at some point." "Okay." So, it was his call that came in to 911 dispatch at 722 that evening. The victim's description of her attacker addressed kind of the essential,

5:44 all of the essentials related to his physical features and appearance, but it wasn't going to give the investigators a lot to go on on that alone. She had been attacked by a white male aged approximately 25 to 30, standing about six-foot tall, with a medium build, as well as a beard and shoulder length light-brown hair. At the time of the attack, he was wearing a three-piece cream-colored suit." "What?" "Yeah." "Weird." "That is really weird." "Row weird." "Do you just come from like a wedding or something?"

6:28 "What?" "Yeah." "Yeah." "It's a weird choice." "Very noticeable too." "Uh-huh." "If there's going to be a lot of weird color palette choices, and that's when you need to remember, this was the 1980s." "Okay." When later questioned, the port police's number one suspect informed them that he didn't even own a suit. Let alone a cream-colored one. "Right." "I don't even have one of those." "Yeah." "Who'd have one of those?" "Oh, well, okay. It's a very impractical wardrobe choice. I would argue." "Yeah." "But I don't know, maybe other people can, you know, function in light-colored clothing. I, for one, would have to swear off like all forms of sauce." "Yeah." "No condiments for this gal." "I don't know how people are doing that."

7:31 "No condiments for you tonight." "Um." "You're wearing very light-colored clothing." "Oh no." "Oh no." "Okay, well, good thing we had some fancy sauce before we decided to record." "She's cut off from the fancy sauce." "So cool." "Consequences." "The man was driving a blue car with a blue interior, which frankly sounds pretty hideous." "Wow. He's very, what is that called, like, monochromatic?" "Yeah." "Like, keeping in the same color palette just different shades." "I didn't even really pick up on that, but you're so right." "But it was very of the time." "The 80s, am I right?" "What up with YouTube?"

8:17 Jerry Seinfeld had like, "Oh, right, right, right, right, yeah." "Yeah." She was also able to describe various items that she had noticed inside his car during the attack. But perhaps most importantly, she said that he had a temporary license plate with digits six and seven repeating in some form. So she was pretty sure it was like a six, six, seven, or maybe a seven, seven, six. "Okay." "If it were me, that's exactly how I would bust one of these fuckers. I would rainman the shit out of them. Okay, because numbers that are useless, oh, I will remember them until I die."

9:03 "Hopefully you don't have to do that ever." "Yeah, yeah, no, I'm just saying like, when I'm driving around in my car, like I'm looking at license plates and I'm just playing all kinds of fun math games with the numbers on people's plates." "We're no." "Yeah." "Now, let me say it out loud, that does seem pretty weird." "Well, weird." "Okay, that's okay, we accept you for who you are." "Okay, great, because that's just kind of the type of neuro-spicy bullshit that my brain picks up on." You know, especially when it's left to its own devices, at length. And I would have to imagine probably most especially when it's attempting to disassociate or going into essentially self-protection mode. So, that's super exciting though, right? Because that's got to be something, like a piece of hard, trackable data that feels evidently, right? Kind of, maybe a little? Yeah. I'm not sure how far you would get though. That doesn't... Yeah, exactly. It's a little bit like, you know, maybe we'll get lucky.

10:19 Maybe all of the blue sedans with blue interior are registered to plates that start with eights. Who knows? Yeah. As investigators work the case, they began developing the rough outlines of their theory. They felt that it seemed pretty likely that the assailant lived in the area nearby. So, they began searching the area around Pacific Highway Sound. As luck would have it. A light blue 1981 Chevy Chevette was located at 120 AM. No one was in it at the time it was initially spotted, so officers waited for the driver to return to the vehicle. They figured it was worth sitting on the car for 20 or 30 minutes if that's what it took. I mean, how often is law enforcement going to get handed a potential lead on a silver platter like this? Yeah. Maybe ruminating in the restaurant parking lot set things off on the wrong foot though. They were immediately suspicious of the man leaving the restaurant with a young attractive woman alongside him. Was she his next victim?

11:42 I don't know. I hope not. They had very little doubt that they had found their man. Because, you know, it's a blue car. So, well, did they... I'm not going to ask any more questions. I'm just going to let you go. You won't be happy with the answers. Yeah. Well, did they check though? I mean, they are... This is literally less than six hours after the car. I'm essentially... So, guys, I don't think you've solved it. I could be wrong, but I rarely am. Yeah, it seems a little bit like... He's your suspect, right? Not like your... Like he's not even a suspect at this point. Because they have no idea who that car belongs to.

12:28 He's a person of interest. Yeah. At best. A suspected suspect. Yes, exactly. Yeah. There's layers. It's like a Bloomin onion at the outback, you know? However, while this was a white man with a similar hairstyle and facial hair, again, I'd like to say it was the '80s, he wasn't exactly a perfect match in their estimation. Because he was only about 5'8", and the victim believed her attacker had been roughly six feet tall. Yeah, it's like a little bit taller than 5'8". Us. Well, come lunches, four inches. Yeah. The witness could have been mistaken about his height.

13:12 Sometimes one detail of a victim's statement might be slightly off, especially after such a traumatic experience. But they weren't going to let this probably super guilty dude drive off into the sunset with another would-be victim. They wouldn't let that happen. No. So they sort of made up or maybe exaggerated just a little bit about a minor traffic infraction as the man made his way down the road so that they could pull the pair over. Is that legal? I mean, it's only illegal if you could cut. Okay. And they are police officers, so they probably won't. Probably not at first.

14:00 The 31-year-old man, Steve Titus, told officers that he and his fiance Mona were returning home to Kent. He had picked her up from Denny's at 930 to celebrate her 21st birthday with a drink. Yeah, it sounds sweet. I don't know if it's true, but yeah. Earlier that day, in the afternoon, he had attended a family gathering until he returned home at around 630. From then on, he'd hung out with a friend watching a movie until he left to pick up Mona. Titus assured the officers that his friend that he'd been with prior to picking up Mona could vouch for his whereabouts. Okay, Alibi, City. All right. In fact, right around the time his friend showed up at the apartment, he'd placed a call to Mona at 7pm on the dot. Okay.

15:01 Steve Titus was a super easygoing dude. So he allowed authorities to search his vehicle, while both he and Mona were questioned individually. He was informed that he matched the description of the attacker provided by the victim. Steve Titus agreed to answer questions at the police station. Even after being told they were investigating a rape allegation involving an attacker that was a preliminary match to his physical description. Yikes. Yeah. Without a lawyer, did he get a lawyer? Well, I mean, if you're not guilty, why would you need a lawyer? Right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Why would you?

15:55 I wonder. Oh, no. Hmm. Let's see how it plays out. Probably not exactly the birthday plans that either of them had envisioned, but they understood that a serious crime had occurred and they wanted to help if they could. Gosh, especially its Mona's birthday, right? Like, she didn't have anything to do with this at all. Exactly. Steve was polite and cooperative throughout the entirety of these interactions, even smiling in the mug shot taken of him at the time. Oh, because I was probably like, yeah, this is like, I'll probably never get to do this again because I'm like such a good person.

16:42 Exactly. Probably what I would do to frame it. It's funny you should say that because, because of the celebratory nature of their evening up to that point, the pair even asked if a photo of the two of them could be taken. They figured, won't this be an interesting story to tell at a cocktail party or to our kids someday? Yeah. Oh, remember that birthday of yours that we spent, you know, a good chunk of the night down at the police station. We just wanted to really try to help the police solve this crime. Yeah, it's a crazy story. Yeah, you need proof. Yeah, because man, if you told anybody about what had happened up to this point, they'd be like, no way. Yeah, Pixar didn't happen. Yeah, Pixar didn't happen. Mug shots or didn't happen. Yeah.

17:43 Because of course, they both knew Steve had zero involvement in the crime. So what was the harm in cooperating with the police? They were just doing their jobs. They were totally doing their job. Totally doing their job the way they're supposed to and not anything else. Feel like you're lying. Sometimes I lie, but it's always on accident. Or to create suspense. Or it's always on accident or it's on purpose. Like I said, or to create suspense. Potato potato. Either way, she's always lying. Yikes. Anywho. Just kidding, I trust her.

18:29 Not long after their visit to the police station, a photo montage was shown to the teenage victim. In fact, it was just the day of following the attack. And it was conducted in her mother's to come home. She reviewed carefully for some moments and then pointed to Titus, stating that it had to be him. He was the closest one. What do you make of that? Not good. No, no, not good. Immediately based on what she says. You know, red flags. Yeah. Yeah, if these are the only options, that's the guy because he has a beard.

19:18 Yeah. Yeah. I'd also like to point out that based on the way this is worded, it sounds like she believes that the perpetrator is most assuredly included amongst the photos. And it's up to her to determine which of the men it was, rather than simply reviewing to identify someone. Whether the attacker was amongst the men's photographs shown to her. It's just like a huge set up. It feels like. Yeah. I just don't get worse. And it's like, it's not her fault. It's not her job to know like what the right thing to do in the situation. Exactly.

20:08 That's what the trained professionals are for. Or in this case, perhaps untrained monkeys. But poor Celia, that was her name, Celia. Of course, as a victim of sexual assault, particularly as a minor, initially her name was kept private. But later, she would decide that she wanted to share her story with the public. Wow. Without an attorney present, Steve Titus was interviewed by law enforcement again. He provided an additional statement regarding his whereabouts at the time of the assault. This session was not recorded. Why not? It's a really good question.

21:00 Isn't that like evidence? Usually a thing that you're supposed to. Sounds like a good idea to me. That night, Steve Titus had been driving a company vehicle. He worked for Iverse, Seafood as District Manager, overseeing roughly 100 other employees of the company between seven area locations. Well, he did. It didn't take long for his life to be turned completely upside down by this case. He was arrested at the company's office on October 14th by Port Police just days after the crime. Normally, I would say alleged sexual assault, but it's without question that Celia was attacked. However, the question remained regardless of how decided law enforcement seemed. Was Steve Titus the guilty party?

22:17 Following his arrest, Steve was able to post his bail of $2,500 after spending the night in jail. That's not a lot. Well, it was 1980. I mean, a little bit more, but still, I guess it wasn't murder. I guess I usually hear those things associated with murder. It's a lot more. It does tend to be a pretty significant sum. Well, this is something you'll be interested in. You asked about this, actually. Is it about ghosts? No. His next step was hiring an attorney who luckily believed his pleas of innocence.

22:57 I would hope so. It's a good word. Well, okay. Defends attorneys don't always believe that their client is innocent. They are just, you know, like anybody else entitled to a good defense. Right. Now, despite the fact that it would not be admissible in court, the prosecution was willing to strike a deal. That if Steve passed a polygraph, the charges against him would be dropped. Oh, boy. Okay. Not admissible in court, but we'll go ahead and drop the charges if you pass. That literally makes no sense, like no sense. It was the '80s wild times. Yeah.

23:40 The man conducting the examination was dui Gillespie. He was a former Seattle police polygrapher. Now, obviously, Steve is thinking, yeah, I'll do it because he's like, you'll just drop the charges. It's like a medicine. And of course, it'll be like negative, right? Or pass. I don't know what the, yeah. Of course. Of course, I'm going to get off scot free because I didn't do this. All accounts indicated that dui Gillespie, he's the one administering the polygraph that he's a very kind and ethical man. He was also a very well-respected expert in the particular field.

24:29 Okay. Like being an expert in bullshit doesn't... Yeah. Well, he actually, I will say this, he has some things to say that I think the prosecution probably was like, you don't, you don't, you don't got to say that. He understood the limitations of the polygraph. Okay. But, you know, it's an imperfect, I want to say science because that's the phrase, but it's, I mean, my god, it's pseudo-science is that what it's called? I mean, almost. Yeah, I mean, there's real science involved, but like... There's little little duhickeys that go back and forth. You know, you know, the duhickeys.

25:14 The duhickeys. Yeah. Is that how they still do it or was that like a really old school type of thing? You know, I don't know. I would assume. Yeah. And they're just not in popular usage. Yeah. Not, I mean, certainly not with the frequency that they once were. So I can't imagine like, you're not going to be upgrading your polygraph machinery at this point. I was thinking, like, maybe now it's like on a computer and they like look you up, but it's like on a computer screen, you know, not just like... And it could be. I think I have seen tests where it's like, oh, this doesn't look like, you know, we time-traveled back to 1930. Yeah. But yeah, I don't know. If anyone's taken a polygraph recently, email us and let us know what it was like. Yeah, right after you email your lawyer.

26:02 Because who the hell let you do that? I mean, some people just have to take them like in the military. Which is just... Okay, we can't go down this road. We can't go down this road. I'm just going to get upset and then I'm going to start losing eyelashes and I can't with this. No. But I have no strong feelings on the topic as per usual. All right. Both the prosecution and defense agreed to him administering the polygraph exam to Steve. Because that's the deal they struck. And like I said, he's known for being like fair, ethical, he's a good dude. And he's real good at this. Unfortunately, when Steve failed the polygraph test, because turns out being real anxious might impact the result.

27:03 There was only one other option offered in lieu of prison time, admit guilt, and submit to a treatment program at a state hospital for sexual psychopaths. Oh my god, the real guy is still out there. Wait, no, Cassie, they've got him. No, they don't. Yeah. You've been Steve didn't do it. It's not great. Steve is such like a nice guy name. I feel like maybe that maybe I'm biased because like I have an uncle named Steve. Yeah. My mom's wife and his name is Steve. Steve. He's probably not listening, but that's okay. Yeah. My mom will be like, Steve, I play this for you real quick.

27:47 Do you know what I realized? What? The like, I think it was the Beetlejuice episode. I mentioned my mom like three different times that I'm constantly talking about my mom. Yeah. Well, is that weird? She's adorable and lovely. She's funny and just, yeah, I'm not seeing the problem, I guess, is what I'm getting at. I love my mom. Sorry. I just love my mom. I'm like, again, still not seeing the problem. I'm obsessed. Have you seen the show Smothered? That's not like it's reverse mother. She's like, God, I wish I could get away from my mom. Of course, being the honest and exuberant young man that he was completely assured of his innocence. Steve declined and so the case went to trial.

28:42 That's the place where we're supposed to have a very well-defined set of rules to help a jury of his peers determine whether he was guilty of the crime beyond a reasonable doubt. Just a quick refresher on that process because there's been a few things that haven't gone exactly. Like, there's most. Yeah. What's unreasonable doubt? I don't think that's, I think that's one of those terms that like doesn't really go both ways. It's like, is it doubt? Just say doubt. Yeah. I don't know. Well, okay. So they do define what reasonable doubt is. So I guess the flip side there is unreasonable doubt. But the way that they define it, it's not really intended to be like two opposites. It's intended to be more like, you know, we are specifically outlining what qualifies. I guess that's true. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know. I might have been just talking out of my ass. It sounds right to me. I was thinking too of like how they picked the jury. Like, they don't want anyone who's biased. So maybe like, yeah. Unreasonable doubt would be like, oh, you're a super biased against this person. Yeah. Well, sir, you believe that all people of this race gender or creed are criminals. So I'm going to say that's unreasonable.

30:11 Dn reasonable. Dn reasonable. On February 25th of 1981, the trial began. So that's just about four months after the attack occurred. So that's pretty quick. That is really fast. Well, fast. The defense tried to argue that the victim's identification of Steve from the photo array should be excluded from evidence. Cassie's nodding her head and she doesn't even know the half of it yet. It's unreasonable. No doubt. No doubt, bra. Very unreasonable. His photos were differently sized and styled compared to the other five included.

31:00 What? I mean, why not just circle his photo with a red pen and draw in arrows pointing to him while you're at it? Like, did any of the other dudes even have like beers in hair? I have no idea. Yeah, I haven't read a lot about what anyone else in the photo array, like what they looked like or anything because everybody's so focused on the fact that like, um, hello, that was all of that was so improper. Yeah. And improper is a polite way of saying, fuck up. Shouldn't that immediately be like what's that called when they do something wrong in it?

31:42 I mean, it should be stricken and should like that shouldn't have been admissible. Yeah. Hello. Like what? I take it your so upset that it might have been included. Did I not say that already? No, I don't think so, but you kind of gave me a way to do every shot. You're not hiding your feelings. No, I'm not very good at it. I have no poker face. This so-called evidence really should have been excluded, just in case you were unclear on my thoughts up to this point. However, the judge left this to the jury to decipher. So yeah, he was like, yep, that's totally allowed. Because you know, so often juries are made up of brilliant legal minds, obviously. Yeah, they have the training to know what should be allowed in the courtroom. Yeah. Yeah. And they know what a proper photo array should look like.

32:41 We're so lucky that we're so educated in this country that we all just get that basic knowledge through school, you know, we're essentially all Brainiacs. Yeah. I can't believe we made it through that with the straight face. Why do we even need the judge? The fuck is the judge for? I mean, that's kind of, I was like, you had one job. You had one job. You know, be the judge. You make the decisions. Whew, I feel it in my temples. Yeah, just like a like an ice pick right to the brain. Okay, but everything else will probably be super legit and linear and point to the clear cut guilt of the man in question, right? Right. They've they've hit their quote of mistakes.

33:23 Totally, except there would be some changes to the timeline in witness testimony. And that would become another troubling aspect of the case and trial, though for some, perhaps only in hindsight, because everything really is clearer in hindsight, I guess. You guys, we have something really exciting to share with you. Let's hear a few words from our new pod besties. Do you find true crime podcasts to murder? Do you breathe oxygen? If you've answered yes to any of these questions, then we have the podcast for you. Live Laugh Larsony, a true petty crime podcast, brings the drama to dumb criminal stories, presenting each crime as a fully produced short story. Our variety show podcast has it all sound effects, parody songs, terrible reenactments, and did we mention drama? Join us, Amanda and Trevin, each Wednesday as we share our dreadful dilemmas, killer facts, and then jump into the sick and twisted world of petty crimes. Let's roll the clip.

34:28 Amy had another solution to dance. Using her drunken misstep as the starting point, Amy's feet quickly improved and Irish jig. The river dance continued to pick up the pace, as she spun around and proceeded to stomp her feet rapidly on the hard ground. You can find Live Laugh Larsony on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you listen to podcasts. Bye. See ya. Check them out, creepy people. You can find their info in our show notes. Now, we don't usually do much in the way of trigger warnings, but I will say maybe fast forward, like 30 seconds if sexual assault is particularly triggering for you. We won't be describing the attack itself, but something is about to happen in the trial that can only be described as a gross retraumatization of the victim. I mean gross in both senses of the word, very exaggerated, and also it gives me the ick. Fast forward. Look at her over there. Push in the buttons.

35:48 The batteries are... Yeah. You're like a mom's like stomping her foot on the floor of the card, trying to break. At one point during the trial, the prosecutor asked the victim whether she recognized her attacker in the courtroom. Clearly pointing to Steve, listen if she doesn't know who the guy is, maybe you shouldn't be pointing him out, but also like what other dude is like, yeah, on a pedestal, but he's sitting at the defense table. Yeah, so exactly. That's what I was trying to get at. I don't think it could be much clearer than that. Okay, but that's not even... that's really not even the bad part. He took it a step further, asking her to approach Steve and... this is a quote, "Step down off the stand and walk over to the defense table and get as close to Titus as he was to you on the night you were raped."

36:56 "Literally shaking your face." "Do you not hear your side?" "This was a man, I assume." "How did you guess?" "Wild guess." "Yeah, wild guess." The victim followed instructions and quickly erupted into tears, sobbing hysterically. The prosecution's tactic no doubt having the intended effect. But here's the thing, facing a courtroom full of people and telling her story of that traumatic night and eventing her life could have easily driven her to tears alone. But forcing her to face a man that she now believed to be the perpetrator, it's unthinkable. And in this particular exercise, I believe it proved to be incredibly unethical for a whole host of reasons. And my God, how badly do you want to win this case? You know, if he's guilty, I can understand being passionate about it. But to do that to the victim, I have a hard time thinking that there's any justification for that. "I'm thinking." "Yeah." When the state's own forensic specialists were called to the stand by the prosecution, they said there was no evidence found that substantiated the girl had been

38:34 in Steve Titus' car. No evidence? Huh? Because she wasn't. Right, right, right. I know every time I read that, every time I say it in my head, I'm seeing Kanye rush the stage, "I'm gonna let you finish." I'm assuming there's gonna be something after that that's better. 18 fingerprints were lifted. And none of them were from the victim. Various fiber samples taken from his vehicle also proved contrary, obstructive, fruitless, and otherwise counterproductive to their case against Titus.

39:20 Sometimes when I get fired up, I like to use multiple adjectives. I have to say, "I'm a little bit trial if there's no evidence." Such a good question. It really is. Literally everything, everything is hedged on this witness identification, this, you know, victim identification, and it's so faulty. What? Yeah, ex. There was no damning DNA staining on the vehicle's interior. The fibers found within the vehicle's interior didn't match the victim's clothing. Hair found in the vehicle was not a match for the victim either. They were, quote, "disimilar to the victim." And I'm sorry, how does someone violently rape someone in their car and eradicate all evidence of that in just a matter of hours? But like there's other like hairs and fibers and things. Right. Yeah. So it's like, okay, well, he didn't just take this and like have the thing like full on Walter White, wiped down.

40:38 Like maybe he hung up plastic everywhere. Yeah. That's, you know what? That's not something she would remember and be able to recall. No. Yeah. You make a good point. I'm sorry. Not just a hat rag, this one. I like that. No, it really points to like just how unreasonable it is to think that like that's possible. Oh, by the way, he also watched a movie with his friend and you know, took a call from his girlfriend and he did all of this in addition to absolutely scrubbing that thing clean. Except if anybody else is DNA. Right. You just tweezered all the hairs out.

41:20 Because there's no way. Like there's no liquid. Yeah. Guys, gross, but I'm sorry. There would be something. You telling me there's no bodily fluid anywhere, anywhere after that? You're going to look me dead in the centers of my soul and tell me there wasn't any bodily fluids. Nothing that you could pick up that like hair too. I know all like not all women have like thick hair, but most of us, you just sit there and think you're careful. So behind, I'm sorry. Yeah. Also like the fibers that were taken from the victim, presumably from the vehicle's interior did not match. It's just like, I'm sorry, but like what do you have here? You just found somebody who was a white guy driving a blue car.

42:12 That's as far as we got. Man. The detective changed the time estimates related to Steve Titus' return home from his family gathering by nearly 30 minutes. On the stand, the detective said that Titus reportedly arrived home at 655 rather than 630 as he had very definitely previously stated. The only period of time that Steve Titus is aware about could not be confirmed by someone else present with him was the 40 minute period from the time he left his parents at shortly after 6 p.m.

42:57 So 610 to put a round number on it to the 650 arrival of his friend, 40 minutes. Whereupon they decided to watch a movie. Ron Parker, the detective, which feels like a generous assessment, the detective that spoke with Titus to collect his statement did not complete a written record of the account and details until months later. Coincidentally, just days to the trial commencing. And I happen to know that that's actually pretty much totally legal. Usually that would only happen in the case of a traffic infraction.

43:52 But yeah, it's, I would say in this case, I guess, it doesn't appear to be technically illegal what he did there. Super unethical and because he changed facts of the case or, you know, testimony, that part, yeah, that's not, that ain't cool. Can't do that. How is that legal to like keep in there? So how this works is basically, if you're changing facts of the case or testimony, things that people have said, obviously, that is not legal. I am not arguing that. I'm saying they don't have to actually record or like complete the citation paperwork in a lot of instances until like six months later. They have like a six month grace period in a lot of jurisdictions.

44:44 So if you are speeding and a police officer sees you speeding, they can just send you a ticket like six months later. This is not that. Yeah, there's no like details that matter. So I don't. Yeah. How are you, how are you recording this six months later when you didn't record the statement? Yeah. It doesn't make sense. It's very like, yeah, I can't remember what I fucking ate yesterday. Like six months from now. How many other cases are you working on to? Exactly. Facts that are important. Like, how do you just remember it all? How can you be sure that you're not getting details of like any details of the case? You know, I mean, oh my god, it's just, it's, it's so unconscionable. And like, regardless of whatever grace period or window that they have to be able to like report things, it's like, right, but you took a statement. Like, you already did that.

45:48 This is recorded. This is something that like, and this is going to be presented in court. So I think you got a pretty good field for how things are going so far. Yeah, not great, not great. Not great. Not looking up. Not great. But you're going to have to wait a little bit to get some information about the rest of the trial. Because it's really hard to divorce some of the remaining details of the trial from the other thing that happens. There's more. Mm-hmm. Okay.

46:30 But I will say, I think we end this on a relatively high note for true crime. Okay. What's that? Oh, no, I mean, at the end of part two. Well, tell me the end. I know she's like, you mother tracker. Okay. So the end is, there's going to be a little bit of light at the end of the tunnel. I don't know. It's after you fuck us all up though. It's okay. Yeah. You're cool. I mean, it's, it still feels, um, pretty unsatisfying on the whole. Just because it's like, yikes, we had to go through all this to get to there. I seem super not worth it. So it's a long walk for a short glass of water, um, in some respects. But I think it's a really important story.

47:20 I trust you. Like I said earlier. Yeah. She's like, for sure. Fuck, I'm very sorry. Oh, well, are we going to do some tarot? Let's do tarot time. Two states tarot, dash, pp, cat. Yeah. Yeah. To both. They're going to come. What did she get? Is that literally the same one that we just put away? Is it? Yes. Okay. It's the eight of ones. Eight of ones. Okay. Well, we both shuffled it.

48:09 That's weird. Yeah. We put, we drew that for, wasn't Beetlejuice, was it? No. I think it was your last one. Oh, interesting. Yeah. It had to have been. Because like, what else would we draw for? Oh my gosh. It makes so much sense. Immediately. I'm looking at the keywords and I'm like, yep. Okay. So weird. We shuffled the crap out of it. We really did. We really did you guys. We really did. We also don't like drawing the same cards. No. It's like not as fun to keep reading the same thing. So we wouldn't do this on purpose. It's a little old. I know. It's thinking we should get like different, like different books. Oh, yeah. We should. Yeah. Because we're still learning. I mean, we don't have them all memorized. There's no way we could, this is like how we are learning is to keep reading the same thing over and over. So yeah. But it would kind of be nice to vary it up a little bit more.

49:01 Yeah. I know. We do a little bit. Well, this one has like the little book. Yeah. I feel like those interpretations aren't really as developed. So yeah. There's like little stories. But okay. So we should add to our to-do list tonight. We should look for some more books. Okay. If anyone has recommendations, yeah. Because you can't really have too many books. I don't, I don't think anyone has ever said that ever in the history of forever. I'm sure lots of people. It's a really stupid people. I love it. Okay. Who left the bag of idiots open? Yeah. That's right. Them don't like books.

49:43 They, oh, okay. Eight of ones are keywords are action, excitement, new experiences and urgency. When the eight of ones appears, you can expect your life to speed up big time. It feels like an understatement. This card suggests lots of action and excitement coming your way. Ooh, excitement doesn't always have to be like a positive though. Yeah. It can be bad. Yeah. Yeah. This was for the school one. Yeah. This is the Carpe Diem card. Whatever you put into motion now takes off at a rapid pace. Oh my god. This isn't saying how well it fits. This case as well. Yeah. I feel like that's on like like the cops side because this poor man didn't like do anything. Yeah. So like nothing he did put this into motion. It was all like the police's fault basically. I mean, yeah, definitely in terms of like what we're thinking of who's that fault for how this evolved. I think, you know, you're definitely talking about like that's, you know, that's on law enforcement, but I will say there are choices that every single person made along the way that played a role in it. Not that they're at fault, but it does, it does change how things, you know, it changes what is set into motion.

51:08 That is true because he did design to like go with them and do the right thing. Yeah. But yeah, that definitely is like punished for being a good guy. Yeah. The eight may also indicate a whirlwind trip. This card shows a busy period in your life when you feel catapulted towards something you desire. Oh, I don't know. Okay. I'm going to have to think about that. Maybe not to I feel like, yeah, some of the wording. I feel like something that's like attracted to you. Maybe not like something you want, but like something that's drawn to you. I don't know. What do you think? Yeah. I agree. Oh, okay.

51:53 I was like, I was like, I want to make sure I didn't cut you off. You know, you always say it better than me. No, sometimes I'm a potato. Perhaps you feel a sense of urgency in financial areas and may need to make split second decisions. Okay. Well, we might have a little bit more on that in part two. In a reading about work, the upright eight suggests a time of inspiration when things happen fast and you have to make quick decisions. Your career moves rapidly forward and you have to hustle to keep up. This card can also represent job-related travel, which is so interesting because obviously, if you're investigating a crime and you're going, you know, travel can be, you know, not necessarily international, like between to comments, yeah, or, you know, if you are somebody who represents seven locations of a local seafood restaurant chain. I don't know. Yeah. Oh, and it did like, it moved really fast, too. And they had to, they obviously made some decisions that were hasty. Yes. But I don't understand why. I guess just like get it done faster. Yeah. I think I feel some of the reversed ones energy from this card, too. So it's kind of interesting. I'm, I'm going to pull from the other

53:31 half of the deck after this. I feel like we did that last time, too. Like we, like, it related with both sides and it just, yeah. I feel like sometimes it kind of just clarifies. But I feel like this card, this is like one of the cards in particular that you pull and even like the imagery of the birds kind of like flying around on it, I feel like it could like go either way, like up or down. Yeah. There's a couple of cards that we've gotten that are like, I'm just, I just keep doing it. And I'm doing the eight. The like, yeah, yeah, figure eight. Yeah. In a reading about love, the upright eight points to a passionate and exciting romance. It can indicate a sudden love affair that sweeps you off your feet or a hasty marriage. It's interesting. Hmm. Okay. Steven Mona, were they like would they like me? They were a little bit of a whirlwind romance in a way. Yeah.

54:28 Okay. Oh boy. Okay. Yeah. Five of points. Yeah. Okay. So we've got, that's, I mean, just very definitive ones energy. Okay. Oh wow. Wow. Wow. Wow. Okay. Key words. And I was like as soon as I looked at that one, I was like, I think I'm remembering some of the like, principles of this card and sort of the, oh yeah, okay. Did we say it's like two bobcats or something fighting each other? Like wrestling, which is like just the imagery of two people like, having a tussle, I don't want to say.

55:11 I think that the keywords and just the description of the traditional tarot card are going to make it very clear. Key words are competition, ego battles, disagreements and confusion. So I can't find one of those that doesn't fit. And when the five of ones appears, it suggests a struggle for power, money or recognition. Ego battles may interfere with the smooth flow of life. In some cases, it shows competition for resources or control. Confusion and disagreements exist. And in the traditional deck, it literally shows five different presumably, you know, male figures that appear to be like battling with like, staffs. They're like kind of play fighting like in the way that like, maybe young boys would. Oh gosh. Okay. The interpretation. Bickering and self-interest cause irritation.

56:20 And you need to concern yourself with getting matters back on track. Wow. There's aspects of the case that I've researched that I didn't even put in my notes for part one that that is just like, woo, front of mind, I might have to try to talk a little bit about that. Discontent may arise from differences in philosophy or personality. When this card shows up, you may be defending your territory, putting up a fight to hold on to what you think is yours. Try to assess the situation objectively. This may be a mock battle or a conflict of egos that lacks genuine substance. Wow. Cannot make that shit up. That is the same. Like, defendant, even the user were defending like mock trial. Yeah. What I kept here. I know. Yeah, this was a mockery. Anyways, in a reading about money, this card may show your financial situation is unstable or competition is heading into your take. Arguments about money and spending cause tension. In a reading about work, the five can represent competition in the marketplace.

57:43 In-house conflicts or stubbornness may also cause problems. Perhaps you're confused about your direction or you lack self-confidence. I think some people were definitely confused. Yeah. I mean, some people might have had a little too much self-confidence. Arguably. In a reading about love, this card suggests you're letting your ego rule. You may stubbornly refuse to compromise or make necessary changes. The five can also reveal differences of perspective that cause problems. I would say putting it as differences of perspective is quite generous in this case, but yeah. Yeah. Wow. Okay. So the part that I, the first sentence, literally of the interpretation, big ring and self-interest cause irritation and you need to concern yourself with getting matters back on track. So Steve Titus' initial defense counsel said that he would get really frustrated only because he could really tell that he really felt that Steve Titus was innocent. He really felt that like deep in like his gut and not everyone that you represent as like a defense attorney is going to be innocent. In fact, arguably, probably maybe a majority of the

59:18 people that you're going to represent are guilty of something and it may not be as violent or as awful as this crime, but a lot of people they don't did the damn thing. But he just really felt like he didn't do this. Like there's, I just, I can't picture it. I believe him and he knew enough about the timeline to know that pieces of it were fabricated in some of the second round of testimony and the different statements that were brought to court. And his frustration not only came from the fact that he felt like Steve Titus was innocent, but that because Steve was so passionate and he was so clearly like, how can this happen? How can I be, you know, facing a conviction when I didn't do this? And you know, like I have alibi witnesses, all of these different things.

1:00:19 And he would just rail against like what the hell is the system that this is allowed to happen? And it's completely understandable, but it wasn't productive. He's like, and he had this conversation with Steve, but also with members of his family where he would say, listen, you guys are paying me $120 an hour to have this conversation or it might have even been, even back then, it might have been $300 an hour. I can't remember what number he said now. As soon as I said 120, I was like, that doesn't quite feel right. I think it was 300 an hour. At any rate, you are paying someone a significant sum to have these conversations where they're trying to develop your defense and they are trying to represent you legally. And while that frustration is super understandable, it's like, this is not productive. It's not good. It's not a good use of your time. It's not a good use of your funds.

1:01:26 Like we have to move on. Let's make the most of all of our resources so that we can prove that you are innocent. And we can get you out of this situation, but can like super understandable why somebody would just be driven to, I mean, damn near the point of madness about, like I didn't do this. How can this happen? It would be terrible. You'd be absolutely beside yourself, I feel like. The money thing, too, kind of made me think of how much funding like the police department had.

1:02:07 I'm sure that they're always trying to like speed things along and want people to do things faster so that you don't spend the money on it. Yeah. I mean, I don't know for sure, but I assume. Yeah. I mean, the other aspect of that too, and it's not something that I delved into specifically in part one, but Steve's parents threw the entirety of their life savings into his defense. Everything they had basically. I mean, yeah, what else you can't not. Yeah, I mean, and the worst part is like, you know, these are people's livelihoods.

1:02:51 They were not young people. I'm sure at some point that would have been money that was designed to help them be able to retire. And my God, but how do you let your child go to prison for a crime that he didn't commit? A crime that they were, I mean, they were such a key part of his alibi. Having been, you know, he came from a family function. And when we really look at the timeline and the places where all of these things occurred, it is just not physically possible. I remember I did read a book about this case where they talked about this guy is either the fastest or the longest dick in the West. And they're because they were like, either he did this in like 15 minutes. And like, that was a lot of things he had to do and pull off in 15 minutes or he's literally stretching his dick all the way from Kent, which I thought was a hilarious visual. It was pretty funny. Yeah.

1:04:03 And you know what? Steve definitely was the bigger-dicked man in this situation. I said, but I said. There was something you said in the beginning of the interpretation about it was just, it probably goes without saying, but it was about power, like wanting power. And you know, everything I've consumed about true crime usually says that like a rape isn't really about like sexual gratification. It's about having like power over somebody. Yeah. That's true. You know, I honestly, because so much of what we talked about in part one was really focused on the fact that it's like, wow, how is this even going to trial? And so I'm thinking about it in terms of like ego battles and power struggles and everything in terms of the law, the legal system and law enforcement.

1:04:55 But it hadn't even occurred to me that like, yes, I mean rape is a crime where someone is trying to assert dominance and they are trying to, you know, gain power and control over someone. So that is, wow, I, and even more the fact that he let her live too. So obviously, it wasn't about killing her. Right. Yeah. It was, it was really just about that. Well, yeah. Oh boy. Oh, oh boy. I feel like I could go on about this case for so long. For another episode. Yeah. And you know, we're not just going to be talking about Steve Titus' trial because they're, I can't really say much more without giving it away. Don't go and look up the case, you fuckers. No spoilers. I mean, if you want to look it up, I guess, but there's just, there's a lot. I mean, to call it a bloom in onion is, it's not an overstatement. There's a lot. Yeah. We're going to bring in some new characters in part two. And yeah, okay, we'll see. We'll all be here. Yeah. She's like, baby. So you. Yeah.

1:06:09 I'm not going to read what's in the little book because I feel like we did a good job and Caitlin has a photo shoot to get to. I do. She's got to like go be happy and in love and whatever. God, that sounds exhausting. I'm just kidding. I'm very excited. It is really hot, though. So I'm a little bit nervous that I'm going to like just melt. I think hopefully there's like just a nice breeze, not too much to ruffle your hair, but enough to make you feel cool. We'll be here in the shade. Wish me luck. Everyone wish her luck right now. One, two, three, go. Okay, I did it.

1:06:50 Oh, okay, you guys. It's really hot and these lashes will fall off if the humidity is too high. Have a creepy ass day. See you next Tuesday. Next Tuesday. Stay away from monochematic outputs and cars. Yeah. Because they might get you in trouble. Also, beards. Apparently no one has beards anymore anyway, which is a pay trail bonus joke. Yeah, sorry. You had to be there. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know how to drink a breather swallow or okay. All right. I see what you did there. I'm not going to say it. Yeah.

1:07:49 That's what she said. And just like that, she said it. Sorry, Michael Scott was just nagging me in the back of my head to say it. As he does. He wouldn't let me not. Yeah. That makes sense. pnwhauntsandhomicides.com