Shelley Shannon (FU$$)

100:00:00,000 --> 00:00:08,640Before long, the summer of mercy was thrust upon the public.200:00:08,640 --> 00:00:15,000Whether they'd been involved or even aware of the national conversation around abortion300:00:15,000 --> 00:00:16,300or not.400:00:16,300 --> 00:00:26,400In 1991, Wichita Police arrested potentially up to 3,000 protesters, thousands of anti-abortion500:00:26,400 --> 00:00:32,960activists gathered for what began as a week-long protest that seemingly never lost600:00:32,960 --> 00:00:58,040steam. Spanning several more. 700:00:58,040 --> 00:01:03,400PNW Haunts and Homicides where we talk about tru crime, the paranorml, and all things creepy in the Pacific Northwest. We do a tarot reading at the end of every episode for a little bit of deeper insight into our800:01:03,400 --> 00:01:07,240topic for the week, so make sure you stick around if you're into that.900:01:07,240 --> 00:01:12,240It's a nice little palette cleanser at the end of a true crime or a scary story.1000:01:12,240 --> 00:01:16,280Yeah, I think we're gonna need it this week.1100:01:16,280 --> 00:01:17,280Okay.1200:01:17,280 --> 00:01:18,580Yeah.1300:01:18,580 --> 00:01:23,600Before we get started today, we are going to switch things up.1400:01:23,600 --> 00:01:28,080We're gonna do a Patreon shout out right at the top.1500:01:28,080 --> 00:01:31,720Who are we shouting out today?1600:01:31,720 --> 00:01:33,720Crystal with a K.1700:01:33,720 --> 00:01:37,720Oh my God, we have always said we love crystals.1800:01:37,720 --> 00:01:38,720We do love crystals.1900:01:38,720 --> 00:01:42,920And now we have our very own Krystal person.2000:01:42,920 --> 00:01:47,400Oh my God, she's cracking herself up over here.2100:01:47,400 --> 00:01:53,560Yes, Krystal actually joined as an annual Patreon member.2200:01:53,560 --> 00:01:57,200So literally is stuck with us for a year.2300:01:57,200 --> 00:01:58,560I know.2400:01:58,560 --> 00:02:02,080Can you imagine?2500:02:02,080 --> 00:02:04,440Oh, Krystal person.2600:02:04,440 --> 00:02:06,480We are gonna have so much fun.2700:02:06,480 --> 00:02:07,480Yeah.2800:02:07,480 --> 00:02:09,440We're super excited to have you.2900:02:09,440 --> 00:02:11,560Thanks for joining us.3000:02:11,560 --> 00:02:16,200And I think the annual membership thing is kind of cool because you get a discount off3100:02:16,200 --> 00:02:19,280the monthly tier rate.3200:02:19,280 --> 00:02:21,200So I think so too.3300:02:21,200 --> 00:02:23,360No, you definitely do.3400:02:23,360 --> 00:02:24,360I think that's cool.3500:02:24,360 --> 00:02:26,040Yeah, I think it's cool too.3600:02:26,040 --> 00:02:27,840That's where it's going without that.3700:02:27,840 --> 00:02:29,320I don't know the details.3800:02:29,320 --> 00:02:34,520I'm assuming you know the details of Patreon because I don't keep track.3900:02:34,520 --> 00:02:38,120So just to clarify, welcome Krystal.4000:02:38,120 --> 00:02:42,480We think the annual membership is really cool.4100:02:42,480 --> 00:02:46,040And I think that's that.4200:02:46,040 --> 00:02:51,800We also have a book review for Patreon on December 2nd.4300:02:51,800 --> 00:02:52,800Yes.4400:02:52,800 --> 00:02:53,800Saturday, December 2nd.4500:02:53,800 --> 00:02:54,800What time is it?4600:02:54,800 --> 00:02:57,9202pm, 12/2 at 2pm.4700:02:57,920 --> 00:02:59,920Pacific, standard time.4800:02:59,920 --> 00:03:01,080Obviously.4900:03:01,080 --> 00:03:02,840Because that's where we are.5000:03:02,840 --> 00:03:03,840That's where we are.5100:03:03,840 --> 00:03:04,840PNW baby.5200:03:04,840 --> 00:03:13,480Our book review and discussion is going to be centered on bright young women, a novel by5300:03:13,480 --> 00:03:16,120Jessica Knoll.5400:03:16,120 --> 00:03:18,560And it has a, I don't know.5500:03:18,560 --> 00:03:19,560Can I say it?5600:03:19,560 --> 00:03:21,040Or am I going to give too much away?5700:03:21,040 --> 00:03:22,040I don't know.5800:03:22,040 --> 00:03:26,160It has a real hashtag never Bundy vibe to it.5900:03:26,160 --> 00:03:27,160Yeah, definitely.6000:03:27,160 --> 00:03:28,640And I think we've talked about it before.6100:03:28,640 --> 00:03:29,640Okay.6200:03:29,640 --> 00:03:31,560In one of the last episodes.6300:03:31,560 --> 00:03:38,720Jessica Knoll is also the author of the book "Luckiest Girl Alive," which was of course then6400:03:38,720 --> 00:03:44,760turned into a movie, which is one of my favorites of all time.6500:03:44,760 --> 00:03:50,080Because I am the creepiest of creepy people.6600:03:50,080 --> 00:03:51,080So.6700:03:51,080 --> 00:03:52,080Yeah.6800:03:52,080 --> 00:03:53,600Yeah, yeah, yeah.6900:03:53,600 --> 00:03:54,880She creepier than me.7000:03:54,880 --> 00:03:58,640I don't know about that.7100:03:58,640 --> 00:04:00,040Just creepy in different ways.7200:04:00,040 --> 00:04:01,040Yeah.7300:04:01,040 --> 00:04:03,920Well, should we say about that?7400:04:03,920 --> 00:04:07,400Should we stop stalling and get to your topic here?7500:04:07,400 --> 00:04:08,640I guess.7600:04:08,640 --> 00:04:10,920All right.7700:04:10,920 --> 00:04:19,760Born March 31st of 1956 to teenage parents and conceived out of wedlock, Shelley came7800:04:19,760 --> 00:04:24,480from humble beginnings in Beaver Dam, Wisconsin.7900:04:24,480 --> 00:04:26,480Ooh, Wisconsin.8000:04:26,480 --> 00:04:27,480Yeah.8100:04:27,480 --> 00:04:28,480Oh, Beaver Dam too.8200:04:28,480 --> 00:04:29,480Beaver Dam.8300:04:29,480 --> 00:04:31,280That kind of relates to Oregon.8400:04:31,280 --> 00:04:32,280Yeah.8500:04:32,280 --> 00:04:33,280Yep.8600:04:33,280 --> 00:04:34,960Beaver State, is that what we are?8700:04:34,960 --> 00:04:36,880I think so, yeah.8800:04:36,880 --> 00:04:43,240In 1974, she would become a young teenage mother herself when she gave birth to her first8900:04:43,240 --> 00:04:45,960child, a daughter.9000:04:45,960 --> 00:04:52,280She met David Shannon soon after, and within about a year, the couple had a child together,9100:04:52,280 --> 00:04:53,800a son.9200:04:53,800 --> 00:04:59,080The family of four moved all over the West Coast before eventually settling in 9300:04:59,080 --> 00:05:02,320Grants Pass, Oregon in 1988.9400:05:02,320 --> 00:05:03,320Wow.9500:05:03,320 --> 00:05:08,400That's kind of a random place to land after traveling all over the West Coast.9600:05:08,400 --> 00:05:09,400Yeah.9700:05:09,400 --> 00:05:10,400I think so.9800:05:10,400 --> 00:05:12,360It's kind of like out there.9900:05:12,360 --> 00:05:13,360It is.10000:05:13,360 --> 00:05:15,360It's a little rural.10100:05:15,360 --> 00:05:16,360Definitely.10200:05:16,360 --> 00:05:18,360Rural juror.10300:05:18,360 --> 00:05:23,640Shelley was primarily a stay-at-home mother during this time, though leading up to the dramatic10400:05:23,640 --> 00:05:29,400events that made her infamous, Shelley had not been raised in the church or actively sought10500:05:29,400 --> 00:05:32,440out religion by her own account.10600:05:32,440 --> 00:05:38,960As an adult, she would begin regularly attending church services and women's Bible study classes.10700:05:38,960 --> 00:05:41,360That sounds really wholesome.10800:05:41,360 --> 00:05:48,120I have a feeling it's not going to stay that way.10900:05:48,120 --> 00:05:49,120Yeah.11000:05:49,120 --> 00:05:55,120When living in Grand Pass, Shelley would become well acquainted, not just with religion,11100:05:55,120 --> 00:06:03,360but with one of the great crusades of right-wing radical religious groups, anti-abortion activism.11200:06:03,360 --> 00:06:05,360Okay.11300:06:05,360 --> 00:06:06,360Yeah.11400:06:06,360 --> 00:06:10,760I don't know how much you know about this.11500:06:10,760 --> 00:06:13,080Probably not a lot.11600:06:13,080 --> 00:06:17,040Things tend to make me angry beyond the point of comprehension.11700:06:17,040 --> 00:06:18,040Yes.11800:06:18,040 --> 00:06:19,040Yeah.11900:06:19,040 --> 00:06:21,040I try to stay away from things.12000:06:21,040 --> 00:06:22,040Yeah.12100:06:22,040 --> 00:06:23,880You're going to learn a lot now.12200:06:23,880 --> 00:06:29,280And then I think probably based on that, you'll go ahead and block it out again.12300:06:29,280 --> 00:06:30,280Okay.12400:06:30,280 --> 00:06:31,280We'll try.12500:06:31,280 --> 00:06:37,160In 1988, she began getting involved with the National Right to Life Committee.12600:06:37,160 --> 00:06:44,320Partially the oldest and largest of anti-abortion groups in the United States.12700:06:44,320 --> 00:06:51,760From there, she was quickly and completely indoctrinated by the arguably even more radical12800:06:51,760 --> 00:06:54,320operation rescue.12900:06:54,320 --> 00:06:59,640An extremist anti-abortion group established in the state of California.13000:06:59,640 --> 00:07:00,640Wow.13100:07:00,640 --> 00:07:01,640California.13200:07:01,640 --> 00:07:02,640I know.13300:07:02,640 --> 00:07:03,920Kind of surprising.13400:07:03,920 --> 00:07:04,920Yeah.13500:07:04,920 --> 00:07:12,640The letter group focuses on more direct and oftentimes violent action, rather than focusing13600:07:12,640 --> 00:07:19,280on lobbying as is typically the tact that the National Right to Life Committee has at13700:07:19,280 --> 00:07:21,720least historically taken.13800:07:21,720 --> 00:07:27,560It's interesting that they think they want to save lives and then they get violent.13900:07:27,560 --> 00:07:29,280How does that make sense?14000:07:29,280 --> 00:07:30,960Make it make sense.14100:07:30,960 --> 00:07:37,720Because they're infamous call to action states, if you believe abortion is murder, act like14200:07:37,720 --> 00:07:39,880it's murder.14300:07:39,880 --> 00:07:43,560What does that mean?14400:07:43,560 --> 00:07:46,360How do you reason with?14500:07:46,360 --> 00:07:48,360Okay.14600:07:48,360 --> 00:07:56,360The organization's headquarters is actually now located in Kansas in what was once an abortion14700:07:56,360 --> 00:08:05,600clinic that eventually shuttered due to repeated instances of harassment, threats, and violence.14800:08:05,600 --> 00:08:07,960By these people?14900:08:07,960 --> 00:08:13,960I would assume at least in part by them may have involved other people and other organizations,15000:08:13,960 --> 00:08:15,800but isn't that lovely?15100:08:15,800 --> 00:08:16,800Yeah.15200:08:16,800 --> 00:08:17,800Interesting.15300:08:17,800 --> 00:08:21,320Shelly quickly became entrenched in protests.15400:08:21,320 --> 00:08:27,640And then less than a year, she racked up dozens of hours worth of community service hours15500:08:27,640 --> 00:08:34,520in addition to fines, all before eventually being sentenced to four weeks jail time as a15600:08:34,520 --> 00:08:37,320result of multiple arrests.15700:08:37,320 --> 00:08:38,320Okay.15800:08:38,320 --> 00:08:40,440So she was so extreme.15900:08:40,440 --> 00:08:42,160The law was getting involved.16000:08:42,160 --> 00:08:43,160Correct.16100:08:43,160 --> 00:08:44,160Got it.16200:08:44,160 --> 00:08:45,160Yeah.16300:08:45,160 --> 00:08:46,160Go big or go home.16400:08:46,160 --> 00:08:47,760And I'm not going home.16500:08:47,760 --> 00:08:48,760Wow.16600:08:48,760 --> 00:08:49,760I'm going to jail.16700:08:49,760 --> 00:08:50,760Yeah.16800:08:50,760 --> 00:08:54,800Well, maybe that is home.16900:08:54,800 --> 00:09:04,480In 1989, she broadened her horizons or more accurately her arrest record by traveling to17000:09:04,480 --> 00:09:12,160additional out of state protests leading to arrests in both Atlanta and Seattle.17100:09:12,160 --> 00:09:22,440For long, her teenage daughter, Angela, was also not only attending the protests alongside17200:09:22,440 --> 00:09:26,640her mother, but also facing arrest at her side.17300:09:26,640 --> 00:09:29,280Oh, what a role model.17400:09:29,280 --> 00:09:38,000It makes me so unspeakably angry when children are dragged into the aspects of somebody else's17500:09:38,000 --> 00:09:45,600crime. And in this case, because she's been indoctrinated and brainwashed.17600:09:45,600 --> 00:09:48,600I hate it.17700:09:48,600 --> 00:09:49,600I hate it.17800:09:49,600 --> 00:09:51,440Poor kiddo.17900:09:51,440 --> 00:09:58,120Before long, the summer of mercy was thrust upon the public, whether they'd been involved18000:09:58,120 --> 00:10:04,520or even aware of the national conversation around abortion or not.18100:10:04,520 --> 00:10:12,000In 1991, which a top police arrested hundreds actually scratched that.18200:10:12,000 --> 00:10:20,960The numbers reported very depending on the source between 1500 and upwards of 2500.18300:10:20,960 --> 00:10:25,440Some reports even verging on close to 3,000.18400:10:25,440 --> 00:10:26,440What?18500:10:26,440 --> 00:10:30,1203,000 protesters.18600:10:30,120 --> 00:10:31,120They...18700:10:31,120 --> 00:10:32,640Let me say that again.18800:10:32,640 --> 00:10:44,400In 1991, which a top police arrested potentially up to 3,000 protesters in July and August.18900:10:44,400 --> 00:10:45,400That summer.19000:10:45,400 --> 00:10:46,400Wow.19100:10:46,400 --> 00:10:54,160Thousands of anti-abortion activists gathered for what began as a week-long protest that seemingly19200:10:54,160 --> 00:10:57,760never lost steam, spanning several more.19300:10:57,760 --> 00:11:01,080So it was supposed to be a week, but it kept going.19400:11:01,080 --> 00:11:02,080Yep.19500:11:02,080 --> 00:11:05,000They were just having the time of their lives.19600:11:05,000 --> 00:11:06,320Sounds like.19700:11:06,320 --> 00:11:07,320Yeah.19800:11:07,320 --> 00:11:13,520I'm sure at this point, the topic became much more difficult to ignore or to feign ignorance19900:11:13,520 --> 00:11:14,520of.20000:11:14,520 --> 00:11:22,280So while it's been a national conversation, pretty much...20100:11:22,280 --> 00:11:26,560I feel like has it not just constantly been in the ether in this country?20200:11:26,560 --> 00:11:29,800Ever since, like, grade school I swear.20300:11:29,800 --> 00:11:31,640I've been hearing about abortion.20400:11:31,640 --> 00:11:35,760It's been like a topic of conversation all of my life.20500:11:35,760 --> 00:11:36,760Yeah.20600:11:36,760 --> 00:11:44,080Well, in Roe v. Wade, the passage in the 70s, like, obviously people were having this conversation20700:11:44,080 --> 00:11:45,080prior to that.20800:11:45,080 --> 00:11:46,400So I mean, yeah.20900:11:46,400 --> 00:11:52,800It spans multiple decades prior to our human existence.21000:11:52,800 --> 00:11:54,800Just, you know.21100:11:54,800 --> 00:11:55,800Yeah.21200:11:55,800 --> 00:11:56,800Yeah.21300:11:56,800 --> 00:11:57,800It's crazy.21400:11:57,800 --> 00:11:58,800I just...21500:11:58,800 --> 00:12:00,720I can't.21600:12:00,720 --> 00:12:05,320Now enter Dr. George Tiller of Wichita, Kansas.21700:12:05,320 --> 00:12:13,760Born 1941, he was a flight surgeon after attending medical school in the 1960s, when he unexpectedly21800:12:13,760 --> 00:12:18,200returned home to tend to his father's medical practice.21900:12:18,200 --> 00:12:24,880He was asked whether he'd continue performing abortions as his father had.22000:12:24,880 --> 00:12:31,680In case you're not totally sure in this moment, this is still very much a true crime podcast.22100:12:31,680 --> 00:12:33,600You guys, I promise.22200:12:33,600 --> 00:12:34,600I believe you.22300:12:34,600 --> 00:12:37,600All of this sounds like crime to me.22400:12:37,600 --> 00:12:38,600Yeah.22500:12:38,600 --> 00:12:39,600It is.22600:12:39,600 --> 00:12:41,720It's, like, inarguably.22700:12:41,720 --> 00:12:47,480But I would nerd out really hard on a lot of unusual topics.22800:12:47,480 --> 00:12:50,640Happily, I learned while researching.22900:12:50,640 --> 00:12:58,480But I digress, and I'm not the only one who occasionally sees their plans diverted.23000:12:58,480 --> 00:13:05,720In the family practice, he would deviate from his own plans for his medical practice career.23100:13:05,720 --> 00:13:12,600Dr. George Tiller performed post-viability abortions.23200:13:12,600 --> 00:13:16,680That word is kind of loaded right now.23300:13:16,680 --> 00:13:21,720Only for several recent decades, like we were just saying.23400:13:21,720 --> 00:13:27,040So I'll state, this was not without significant conditions.23500:13:27,040 --> 00:13:34,440We are talking about serious birth defects of the fetus, or serious irreparable bodily23600:13:34,440 --> 00:13:36,760harm to the pregnant person.23700:13:36,760 --> 00:13:46,520Oh, and by the way, you still needed two independent providers to sign off on your behalf for23800:13:46,520 --> 00:13:48,520the latter scenario.23900:13:48,520 --> 00:13:49,520Wow.24000:13:49,520 --> 00:13:51,520Okay, two.24100:13:51,520 --> 00:13:52,520Okay.24200:13:52,520 --> 00:14:00,120Still, for some reason, he became a significant target for anti-abortion extremist groups, and24300:14:00,120 --> 00:14:04,720their various versions of violence and protests.24400:14:04,720 --> 00:14:11,040But why would someone suddenly change course to practice medicine in a decidedly different24500:14:11,040 --> 00:14:18,420field than originally intended, and in a very polarized part of the country, where many24600:14:18,420 --> 00:14:28,080religious or conservative people, local and otherwise, would not take kindly to this work?24700:14:28,080 --> 00:14:29,600Cassie's got nothing.24800:14:29,600 --> 00:14:30,600She's like, why?24900:14:30,600 --> 00:14:31,600I don't know.25000:14:31,600 --> 00:14:33,200I don't know.25100:14:33,200 --> 00:14:41,000Just a month before he planned to start a dermatology residency program in 1970, Dr. Tiller25200:14:41,000 --> 00:14:50,440's father, mother, sister, and brother-in-law were all killed in a tragic accident.25300:14:50,440 --> 00:14:52,520Oh, my God.25400:14:52,520 --> 00:14:58,880As he was poised to take a huge step forward in his professional medical career, he was struck25500:14:58,880 --> 00:15:05,840by unimaginable tragedy, but also an impossible task.25600:15:05,840 --> 00:15:14,600As his sister's wishes were for him to take care of her son in the unlikely event of her25700:15:14,600 --> 00:15:15,600death.25800:15:15,600 --> 00:15:18,840Oh, wow.25900:15:18,840 --> 00:15:25,680Let the record state that whether she's listening or not, I want my friend Stephanie to know how26000:15:25,680 --> 00:15:34,080seriously this role would be undertaken in my case, which is a non-custodial scenario.26100:15:34,080 --> 00:15:37,400But I can't even imagine.26200:15:37,400 --> 00:15:44,320Like I'm a God-parent, like in the warm, fuzzy feeling way.26300:15:44,320 --> 00:15:46,840I can't imagine the pressure.26400:15:46,840 --> 00:15:49,640I know, just like gaining a whole child.26500:15:49,640 --> 00:15:50,640Yeah.26600:15:50,640 --> 00:15:51,640That's a lot.26700:15:51,640 --> 00:15:54,440And then like losing all of that family on top of it.26800:15:54,440 --> 00:15:55,440Oh my God.26900:15:55,440 --> 00:15:56,440That's a lot.27000:15:56,440 --> 00:16:01,560You're grieving the loss of basically your entire family.27100:16:01,560 --> 00:16:07,040And suddenly thrown into, oh, by the way, he just had a kid.27200:16:07,040 --> 00:16:08,880That kid is also grieving.27300:16:08,880 --> 00:16:09,880Yeah.27400:16:09,880 --> 00:16:12,200Oh, wow.27500:16:12,200 --> 00:16:13,480He was really, really young.27600:16:13,480 --> 00:16:20,920He probably was not ultimately old enough to remember any of the family that passed.27700:16:20,920 --> 00:16:22,080Oh, I see.27800:16:22,080 --> 00:16:27,520I think he was, I want to say, around 14 months old.27900:16:27,520 --> 00:16:29,920He was under age two, as I recall.28000:16:29,920 --> 00:16:33,240So that's still going to be very traumatic for--28100:16:33,240 --> 00:16:34,240Of course.28200:16:34,240 --> 00:16:36,000--even that young of a child who is--28300:16:36,000 --> 00:16:37,000Absolutely.28400:16:37,000 --> 00:16:40,640--raised with people and all of a sudden they're gone and they don't understand why.28500:16:40,640 --> 00:16:41,640Yeah.28600:16:41,640 --> 00:16:42,840Oh, that's so sad.28700:16:42,840 --> 00:16:43,840Yeah.28800:16:43,840 --> 00:16:45,520Now, listen.28900:16:45,520 --> 00:16:51,280Under different circumstances, we'd all be giving Dr. Tiller a skeptical raise of the29000:16:51,280 --> 00:16:52,280eyebrow.29100:16:52,280 --> 00:16:54,640Because I mean, come on.29200:16:54,640 --> 00:16:56,440What are the chances?29300:16:56,440 --> 00:17:04,120It's pretty unusual for one's damn near entire family to be taken out in one fell swoop.29400:17:04,120 --> 00:17:06,680Unless it's intentional, right?29500:17:06,680 --> 00:17:16,760But sadly, Dr. Tiller's story is one of sorrow and unrelentingly horrific bad luck.29600:17:16,760 --> 00:17:24,040In the midst of this unexpected and unimaginable loss, George returned to his hometown to tend29700:17:24,040 --> 00:17:29,280to his father's practice of roughly three decades.29800:17:29,280 --> 00:17:33,400Can you imagine being expected to practice medicine?29900:17:33,400 --> 00:17:34,400Just period.30000:17:34,400 --> 00:17:35,880Full stop.30100:17:35,880 --> 00:17:37,880Under these circumstances?30200:17:37,880 --> 00:17:38,880No.30300:17:38,880 --> 00:17:39,880No.30400:17:39,880 --> 00:17:40,880Hashtag.30500:17:40,880 --> 00:17:42,880Not a doctor.30600:17:42,880 --> 00:17:46,480Certainly don't want to be a doctor in that scenario.30700:17:46,480 --> 00:17:47,480Yeah.30800:17:47,480 --> 00:17:48,480What?30900:17:48,480 --> 00:17:51,600I feel like you need all of your brains to be at attention.31000:17:51,600 --> 00:17:52,600Yeah.31100:17:52,600 --> 00:17:53,600Wow.31200:17:53,600 --> 00:18:00,240Which I'm sure having something to focus on, like his work was probably, that was probably31300:18:00,240 --> 00:18:08,440a really healthy way for him to try to channel a lot of, you know, his attention and his time,31400:18:08,440 --> 00:18:09,440but my God.31500:18:09,440 --> 00:18:13,440That makes sense, yeah.31600:18:13,440 --> 00:18:18,880His father had been a general healthcare provider to many living in the mid-sized city31700:18:18,880 --> 00:18:20,840of Wichita.31800:18:20,840 --> 00:18:29,200That he had also offered safe abortion surfaces to his patients that required it.31900:18:29,200 --> 00:18:37,320Though it was reluctantly so, after the local community suffered a terrible tragedy, reportedly32000:18:37,320 --> 00:18:40,760dating back to the 1940s.32100:18:40,760 --> 00:18:47,920He had refused an abortion to a woman who already had two children, the second having been very32200:18:47,920 --> 00:18:50,680recently born.32300:18:50,680 --> 00:18:57,880When he refused, she found someone outside the medical profession willing to help her.32400:18:57,880 --> 00:19:03,480Unfortunately, complications from that procedure led to her death.32500:19:03,480 --> 00:19:07,360Oh, that is so scary and so sad.32600:19:07,360 --> 00:19:08,360It is.32700:19:08,360 --> 00:19:12,440You don't have any other option.32800:19:12,440 --> 00:19:20,520And though abortions had been performed at the clinic previously, it was in 1973, following32900:19:20,520 --> 00:19:26,040the Roe v. Wade decision that the picketing began.33000:19:26,040 --> 00:19:33,640But as violence often does, particularly when driven by unbending religious extremism,33100:19:33,640 --> 00:19:36,160it only escalated from there.33200:19:36,160 --> 00:19:45,560Still, it wasn't until 1983 that the clinic that Dr. Teller had taken over from his father33300:19:45,560 --> 00:19:47,400was fire bombed.33400:19:47,400 --> 00:19:49,920Oh my God, what?33500:19:49,920 --> 00:19:56,560Shelley was one of many that were arrested multiple times during that period.33600:19:56,560 --> 00:19:57,880Fire bombed?33700:19:57,880 --> 00:20:01,000I'm like stuck on that.33800:20:01,000 --> 00:20:03,640They fire bombed it.33900:20:03,640 --> 00:20:06,440That's violent as fuck.34000:20:06,440 --> 00:20:07,440It is.34100:20:07,440 --> 00:20:15,760If you're stuck on it, and I was when I read it, and I can't even tell you the number of,34200:20:15,760 --> 00:20:23,880and just the array of rabbit holes that I started to fall down about fire bombing.34300:20:23,880 --> 00:20:25,880I don't know what that means.34400:20:25,880 --> 00:20:27,960Is it a literal fire bomb?34500:20:27,960 --> 00:20:29,360Literally have that.34600:20:29,360 --> 00:20:37,880That's because I just think that especially in this context, it's really important to understand34700:20:37,880 --> 00:20:38,880it.34800:20:38,880 --> 00:20:39,880Okay.34900:20:39,880 --> 00:20:42,240I'm thinking a literal fire bomb.35000:20:42,240 --> 00:20:43,240Yeah.35100:20:43,240 --> 00:20:44,240A bomb of fire.35200:20:44,240 --> 00:20:51,840Fire bombing is pretty much what it sounds like if you're unfamiliar, but I feel the need35300:20:51,840 --> 00:20:59,160to explain this gorilla tactic just a little bit because within the definition are some35400:20:59,160 --> 00:21:03,400pretty intense implications.35500:21:03,400 --> 00:21:11,920From Wikipedia, fire bombing is a bombing technique designed to damage a target, generally35600:21:11,920 --> 00:21:19,720an urban area through the use of fire caused by incendiary devices rather than from the35700:21:19,720 --> 00:21:23,400blast effect of large bombs.35800:21:23,400 --> 00:21:32,520In popular usage, any act in which an incendiary device is used to initiate a fire is often described35900:21:32,520 --> 00:21:35,200as fire bombing.36000:21:35,200 --> 00:21:39,200If a fire catches, it could spread.36100:21:39,200 --> 00:21:45,400Being in adjacent buildings that would have been largely unaffected by a high explosive36200:21:45,400 --> 00:21:47,640bomb.36300:21:47,640 --> 00:21:53,160This is a more effective use of the payload that a bomber could carry.36400:21:53,160 --> 00:21:54,160Wow.36500:21:54,160 --> 00:21:58,640So it does more damage than an actual big bomb.36600:21:58,640 --> 00:21:59,640Yeah.36700:21:59,640 --> 00:22:00,640In some cases.36800:22:00,640 --> 00:22:03,800I mean, not obviously like not a nuke, but like.36900:22:03,800 --> 00:22:04,800Right.37000:22:04,800 --> 00:22:12,760And the crazy thing about it and this is actually a conversation that kind of spun out from trying37100:22:12,760 --> 00:22:23,600to wrap my head around this topic is that the way that we bomb in the modern era, it's37200:22:23,600 --> 00:22:24,600very violent.37300:22:24,600 --> 00:22:32,720I mean, that's still indisputable, but it's very precise.37400:22:32,720 --> 00:22:46,040So you can literally land a device on the engine block of a car and take out the front half37500:22:46,040 --> 00:22:51,000of a vehicle from miles away.37600:22:51,000 --> 00:23:02,280You're nowhere near that entire fire or not fire incident.37700:23:02,280 --> 00:23:09,820It's mind blowing, but in this instance, think Molotov cocktail here, kids, it's guerrilla37800:23:09,820 --> 00:23:13,720warfare with something as simple as gasoline.37900:23:13,720 --> 00:23:21,520That's so scary because literally anyone can do it and they are obviously.38000:23:21,520 --> 00:23:26,080And that sentiment, you're a witch.38100:23:26,080 --> 00:23:27,080I know.38200:23:27,080 --> 00:23:29,080Because it's.38300:23:29,080 --> 00:23:30,840I can't even believe it.38400:23:30,840 --> 00:23:36,880It gets so much scarier for that specific reason.38500:23:36,880 --> 00:23:43,000And you'll see why I was flabbergasted.38600:23:43,000 --> 00:23:49,080These wartime tactics brought to the home front in small cities and towns all over America38700:23:49,080 --> 00:23:57,560in the name of a cause that in this case, I particularly cannot wrap my head around.38800:23:57,560 --> 00:24:04,560You are fighting for the birth of something that in some sad cases amounts to little more38900:24:04,560 --> 00:24:12,200than a cluster of cells that cannot lead to a live birth.39000:24:12,200 --> 00:24:21,040These are instances where these are children that will, in many cases, never be because of39100:24:21,040 --> 00:24:27,920the nature of the types of abortion services that he offered.39200:24:27,920 --> 00:24:38,400I can't wrap my head around how you hate someone that much if you understand those facts.39300:24:38,400 --> 00:24:39,400I just.39400:24:39,400 --> 00:24:41,520I don't know.39500:24:41,520 --> 00:24:49,040I don't want to sound callous because fertility and the value of human life are, of course,39600:24:49,040 --> 00:24:53,440incredibly emotionally charged topics.39700:24:53,440 --> 00:24:59,400But how do you justify the level of violence that fire bombing constitutes against another39800:24:59,400 --> 00:25:03,440living, breathing human being in these cases?39900:25:03,440 --> 00:25:11,960We're not talking about people that are, in any way, casually having an abortion performed.40000:25:11,960 --> 00:25:17,880Everyone involved at this stage has been through enough.40100:25:17,880 --> 00:25:24,880How do you justify harassing someone who is already uniquely traumatized outside of a clinic40200:25:24,880 --> 00:25:31,000where they are trying to seek care for a medical issue that could already have been one of the40300:25:31,000 --> 00:25:40,480most devastating and painful experiences of their own as well as of their family's lives?40400:25:40,480 --> 00:25:47,480Most of a pregnancy or experiencing one that is no longer medically viable is heartbreaking40500:25:47,480 --> 00:25:48,960enough.40600:25:48,960 --> 00:25:54,640And something that there's entirely too much shame around to this day.40700:25:54,640 --> 00:26:02,720It's something that can happen spontaneously, reportedly up to 26% of the time, and oftentimes40800:26:02,720 --> 00:26:07,840before the pregnancy is even realized by the host.40900:26:07,840 --> 00:26:16,120And I say, "host intentionally," not to sound cold, but because a fetus like any guest41000:26:16,120 --> 00:26:18,160can overstay their welcome.41100:26:18,160 --> 00:26:20,680That's a good way to put it.41200:26:20,680 --> 00:26:28,360If you put the life of your host at risk under any other circumstance, that would be deemed41300:26:28,360 --> 00:26:29,360unacceptable.41400:26:29,360 --> 00:26:31,440That's true.41500:26:31,440 --> 00:26:41,120Now, obviously there were some situations where the abortions performed were because of41600:26:41,120 --> 00:26:44,920very serious birth defects and things like that.41700:26:44,920 --> 00:26:51,560And certainly for some people, that's an ethical issue or debate.41800:26:51,560 --> 00:26:59,240And I just can't believe we're having this conversation still in this country.41900:26:59,240 --> 00:27:01,240But our whole lives.42000:27:01,240 --> 00:27:08,800But it happens to more women than we care to think or to talk about.42100:27:08,800 --> 00:27:15,360Laws like the one Texas attempted to stand up, victimize women who experience incredibly42200:27:15,360 --> 00:27:23,080normal, but deeply traumatizing things like a miscarriage or an ectopic pregnancy.42300:27:23,080 --> 00:27:28,680And people like Shelley are part of the reason why.42400:27:28,680 --> 00:27:34,000As a woman socialized in this country, I can say that it's nearly impossible not to feel42500:27:34,000 --> 00:27:41,600a sense of loss or shame, and by no fault of your own, other than being a human that participates42600:27:41,600 --> 00:27:45,720in a biological process.42700:27:45,720 --> 00:27:51,280As much as I would fight for a woman's right not to have a child, I would fight to my dying42800:27:51,280 --> 00:27:55,800breath to protect another mother's child.42900:27:55,800 --> 00:28:02,280But thankfully, we're not here to talk about either me or motherhood.43000:28:02,280 --> 00:28:08,880We're here to talk about Shelley and some other duchess that she hangs out with.43100:28:08,880 --> 00:28:14,040It was after her multiple arrests during the summer of mercy in Wichita that Shelley43200:28:14,040 --> 00:28:21,960claimed she felt what the army of God describes as a call to forceful action.43300:28:21,960 --> 00:28:22,960Okay.43400:28:22,960 --> 00:28:24,520Red flag.43500:28:24,520 --> 00:28:26,520Literally makes no sense.43600:28:26,520 --> 00:28:36,360Like, I just, like, do you not, the combination of words?43700:28:36,360 --> 00:28:38,360Do you not hear your soul?43800:28:38,360 --> 00:28:39,360Yeah.43900:28:39,360 --> 00:28:40,360No, they don't.44000:28:40,360 --> 00:28:42,120No, no.44100:28:42,120 --> 00:28:46,640If you're hearing alarm bells, you are correct.44200:28:46,640 --> 00:28:54,160In 1992, Shelley set fire to the Catalina Medical Center in Ashland, one of the only abortion44300:28:54,160 --> 00:28:56,600providers in the area.44400:28:56,600 --> 00:29:02,380No one was injured, but the provider did reportedly decide to retire after receiving additional44500:29:02,380 --> 00:29:03,380threats.44600:29:03,380 --> 00:29:04,380Wow.44700:29:04,380 --> 00:29:10,840You just, like, changed multiple people's entire lives with violence.44800:29:10,840 --> 00:29:12,560Congratulations.44900:29:12,560 --> 00:29:20,600It was a clearly premeditated attack that Shelley later recalled in great detail.45000:29:20,600 --> 00:29:26,560Being quite emboldened, Shelley published how to destroy a killing center.45100:29:26,560 --> 00:29:28,560Oh my God.45200:29:28,560 --> 00:29:29,860Hyphen.45300:29:29,860 --> 00:29:35,240If you're just an old grandma who can't get a fire started in her fireplace.45400:29:35,240 --> 00:29:38,120I'm just rapid blinking.45500:29:38,120 --> 00:29:40,120But you.45600:29:40,120 --> 00:29:41,120What?45700:29:41,120 --> 00:29:50,320Published on the army of God website, which featured bizarrely detailed instructions45800:29:50,320 --> 00:29:57,640for how to proceed should one find themselves similarly motivated in their own local community45900:29:57,640 --> 00:30:08,800and wishing to avoid prosecution, you know, for by your bombing, a building.46000:30:08,800 --> 00:30:10,800It's literal terrorism.46100:30:10,800 --> 00:30:11,800Like, what?46200:30:11,800 --> 00:30:13,520I'm glad you said that.46300:30:13,520 --> 00:30:16,600Under God's name, well, I guess that happens.46400:30:16,600 --> 00:30:18,040I mean, I know that happens.46500:30:18,040 --> 00:30:19,040It's just like.46600:30:19,040 --> 00:30:20,040Cassie.46700:30:20,040 --> 00:30:21,040Hmm.46800:30:21,040 --> 00:30:26,960Her how to guide remains on the army of God website.46900:30:26,960 --> 00:30:31,480I didn't pay it a visit, but I can confirm.47000:30:31,480 --> 00:30:41,200The army of God is a US-based Christian terrorist organization as designated by the US government.47100:30:41,200 --> 00:30:49,520Words from the US Department of Justice that I would both eagerly and staunchly stand behind.47200:30:49,520 --> 00:30:52,360How was their website still up?47300:30:52,360 --> 00:30:58,600Like I understand free speech, but like that's you're literally instructing people on how47400:30:58,600 --> 00:31:00,440to commit terrorism.47500:31:00,440 --> 00:31:02,600Yeah, that's fucked up.47600:31:02,600 --> 00:31:04,000Domestic terrorism.47700:31:04,000 --> 00:31:08,080Is it on the dark web or is it just on the regular internet?47800:31:08,080 --> 00:31:09,720It's on the regular internet.47900:31:09,720 --> 00:31:12,160So I'm like, okay, dark web, whatever.48000:31:12,160 --> 00:31:13,840There's a bunch of shit on there.48100:31:13,840 --> 00:31:15,320I don't understand it.48200:31:15,320 --> 00:31:16,320But yeah.48300:31:16,320 --> 00:31:18,160I don't want to.48400:31:18,160 --> 00:31:26,680But this is just something that any person could come across, access.48500:31:26,680 --> 00:31:35,440So on August 19th of 1993, Dr. Tiller was in his car preparing to drive home at the end48600:31:35,440 --> 00:31:38,040of his workday at the clinic.48700:31:38,040 --> 00:31:43,040Shelley lay in wait and fired upon him several times.48800:31:43,040 --> 00:31:50,240And though he was indeed shot in both arms, he not only survived his injuries, but returned48900:31:50,240 --> 00:31:54,720to his practice the actual ass next day.49000:31:54,720 --> 00:31:56,520The next day?49100:31:56,520 --> 00:31:58,480Wow.49200:31:58,480 --> 00:32:04,520I cannot even imagine how scary and traumatizing that was to come back the next day.49300:32:04,520 --> 00:32:07,120Like to go back at all.49400:32:07,120 --> 00:32:08,320Yeah.49500:32:08,320 --> 00:32:19,440And while Shelley was really busy being significantly less successful at anything, the next day, good.49600:32:19,440 --> 00:32:26,200Though Shelley managed to evade arrest in Wichita initially, she was arrested in Oklahoma49700:32:26,200 --> 00:32:29,160as she was returning her rental car.49800:32:29,160 --> 00:32:34,880That same year, Shelley's daughter, Angela, was said to have written a death threat to another49900:32:34,880 --> 00:32:37,880abortion provider in Milwaukee, Wisconsin.50000:32:37,880 --> 00:32:38,880Aww.50100:32:38,880 --> 00:32:46,240Though it was Shelley that would at least attempt to take credit for the crime.50200:32:46,240 --> 00:32:52,240Shelley's husband, David, would turn on the news the next day after being instructed50300:32:52,240 --> 00:32:59,520by a friend, only to find that his wife appeared to be on the news and was being arrested.50400:32:59,520 --> 00:33:03,360Did he like have any idea about any of this?50500:33:03,360 --> 00:33:04,360Nope.50600:33:04,360 --> 00:33:06,560Oh my God.50700:33:06,560 --> 00:33:12,600Though it couldn't have been easy to tell that it was his wife, since police had wrapped50800:33:12,600 --> 00:33:19,080her in, I've heard either a towel or in paper towels.50900:33:19,080 --> 00:33:21,880Depending on the source.51000:33:21,880 --> 00:33:26,520They wrapped her up to avoid news cameras identifying her.51100:33:26,520 --> 00:33:27,680Oh, okay.51200:33:27,680 --> 00:33:29,120I was just like, why?51300:33:29,120 --> 00:33:30,120I don't get it.51400:33:30,120 --> 00:33:31,120Yeah, she went.51500:33:31,120 --> 00:33:33,560She didn't make any sense to me either.51600:33:33,560 --> 00:33:36,960I was like, what in the actual fuck are you talking about?51700:33:36,960 --> 00:33:38,840I hope it was paper towels.51800:33:38,840 --> 00:33:39,840I really do too.51900:33:39,840 --> 00:33:42,480I hope she was walking out of there looking like bandage man.52000:33:42,480 --> 00:33:43,480Yeah.52100:33:43,480 --> 00:33:49,600At the time of her arrest, he had reportedly been completely unaware of her plans.52200:33:49,600 --> 00:33:56,200He has remarkably condescending quote that would normally infuriate me.52300:33:56,200 --> 00:34:01,680But for Shelley, all at its light.52400:34:01,680 --> 00:34:05,120Furthermore, he apparently did not share her radical beliefs.52500:34:05,120 --> 00:34:08,520That's why I'm going to let it slide.52600:34:08,520 --> 00:34:12,440That's at least according to comments provided following her crime.52700:34:12,440 --> 00:34:16,360He basically said, um, I don't know.52800:34:16,360 --> 00:34:19,480This is Shelley's little hobby.52900:34:19,480 --> 00:34:21,280I don't partake.53000:34:21,280 --> 00:34:24,160I'm busy in the garage.53100:34:24,160 --> 00:34:27,960I'm busy just being a normal ass person.53200:34:27,960 --> 00:34:30,360Oh my gosh.53300:34:30,360 --> 00:34:36,360If you don't have any awareness of what your wife is doing and it's something like that's53400:34:36,360 --> 00:34:38,360that big.53500:34:38,360 --> 00:34:39,360Yeah.53600:34:39,360 --> 00:34:42,440I wanted to be fair.53700:34:42,440 --> 00:34:49,440Any woman can fly halfway across the country and do something completely different than53800:34:49,440 --> 00:34:52,960what she's telling her husband she's doing.53900:34:52,960 --> 00:34:55,280Yeah, I guess that's true.54000:34:55,280 --> 00:35:01,120In Shelley's initial statements, she tried to claim that she had not intended to kill54100:35:01,120 --> 00:35:02,120Dr. Tiller.54200:35:02,120 --> 00:35:04,280I was just shooting at him a little bit.54300:35:04,280 --> 00:35:05,280Yeah.54400:35:05,280 --> 00:35:07,400But crazy is as crazy does.54500:35:07,400 --> 00:35:08,920Apparently.54600:35:08,920 --> 00:35:12,080Because she quickly changed her story.54700:35:12,080 --> 00:35:16,680This did not go unnoticed through the course of her trial.54800:35:16,680 --> 00:35:18,120Imagine that.54900:35:18,120 --> 00:35:22,960The jury deliberated for one hour.55000:35:22,960 --> 00:35:27,280We're sentencing her to 11 years behind bars.55100:35:27,280 --> 00:35:28,600Damn.55200:35:28,600 --> 00:35:30,440One hour is not a lot.55300:35:30,440 --> 00:35:31,440Nope.55400:35:31,440 --> 00:35:37,360It's not usually a good thing when the jury comes back quickly.55500:35:37,360 --> 00:35:39,440I mean, for the defendant.55600:35:39,440 --> 00:35:40,640Yeah.55700:35:40,640 --> 00:35:43,040What did she change her story to?55800:35:43,040 --> 00:35:52,920Oh, just to the actual truth where she is truly evil and thinks that she has55900:35:52,920 --> 00:36:02,200been called by God to perpetrate unspeakable violence on other people in this world in order56000:36:02,200 --> 00:36:08,240to prevent any unborn baby from being harmed.56100:36:08,240 --> 00:36:12,040Was she trying to do the whole insanity thing?56200:36:12,040 --> 00:36:13,720Because that sounds a thing.56300:36:13,720 --> 00:36:16,480She does sound insane.56400:36:16,480 --> 00:36:22,880Not in the legal sense, but Angela was charged for threatening the murder.56500:36:22,880 --> 00:36:31,440She was the doctor in Wisconsin in 1997 and she was sentenced to 46 months.56600:36:31,440 --> 00:36:36,720Though Shelley had tried to take the blame for her daughter, Angela's prints were on the56700:36:36,720 --> 00:36:37,720letter.56800:36:37,720 --> 00:36:43,720Oh, well, so you can't get away from that, can you?56900:36:43,720 --> 00:36:44,720No.57000:36:44,720 --> 00:36:48,240Fingerprints are pretty solid.57100:36:48,240 --> 00:36:53,240She would later be released in 2001 after completing her sentence.57200:36:53,240 --> 00:36:54,240Angela.57300:36:54,240 --> 00:36:55,240Angela.57400:36:55,240 --> 00:36:56,240Yeah, just clarify.57500:36:56,240 --> 00:36:57,240How old was she?57600:36:57,240 --> 00:36:59,680She was born in 1974.57700:36:59,680 --> 00:37:05,320So right after the passage of Roe v. Wade, just crazy.57800:37:05,320 --> 00:37:09,200So by 1997, that would make her, what, like, 23?57900:37:09,200 --> 00:37:11,080Something like that, okay.58000:37:11,080 --> 00:37:13,480Still too young to be threatening people.58100:37:13,480 --> 00:37:14,480Oh, yeah.58200:37:14,480 --> 00:37:17,520There is really not an acceptable age for that.58300:37:17,520 --> 00:37:18,520No.58400:37:18,520 --> 00:37:21,600Not a fan.58500:37:21,600 --> 00:37:26,320But Shelley's legal issues weren't entirely over.58600:37:26,320 --> 00:37:34,640In 1995, Shelley was sentenced to 20 years for federal crimes connected to various clinic58700:37:34,640 --> 00:37:35,640bombings.58800:37:35,640 --> 00:37:37,040Wow.58900:37:37,040 --> 00:37:43,000She was to serve the 11-year sentence for attempted murder prior to the additional59000:37:43,000 --> 00:37:45,840sentence of 20 years.59100:37:45,840 --> 00:37:46,840That's awesome.59200:37:46,840 --> 00:37:54,600Additionally, she was ordered to pay restitution to some of the clinics impacted by the attacks.59300:37:54,600 --> 00:37:55,600Damn.59400:37:55,600 --> 00:37:56,600Yeah.59500:37:56,600 --> 00:38:03,240And I don't know that they ever really saw any of that money, but it's the principle of59600:38:03,240 --> 00:38:04,240the thing.59700:38:04,240 --> 00:38:05,240It really is.59800:38:05,240 --> 00:38:06,240I agree.59900:38:06,240 --> 00:38:09,880You have to give your money to the people that you hate the most.60000:38:09,880 --> 00:38:10,880Yeah.60100:38:10,880 --> 00:38:17,320People can have a lot of differing opinions and feelings about abortion.60200:38:17,320 --> 00:38:20,040We don't have to agree on that issue.60300:38:20,040 --> 00:38:26,040If we don't, then you're wrong, but we don't have to agree.60400:38:26,040 --> 00:38:36,320But Shelley Shannon is a heinous, violent, terrorist, as is Scott Roder.60500:38:36,320 --> 00:38:42,880There are no two ways about it, but that's not the end of our story, unfortunately.60600:38:42,880 --> 00:38:48,320But you could probably guess that since I just introduced another character to this story.60700:38:48,320 --> 00:38:49,320Yeah.60800:38:49,320 --> 00:38:50,880Plot twist.60900:38:50,880 --> 00:38:53,360Spoiler alert, we hate him.61000:38:53,360 --> 00:38:54,360Okay.61100:38:54,360 --> 00:38:55,360I figured.61200:38:55,360 --> 00:38:56,360Sorry.61300:38:56,360 --> 00:39:01,000I tried to introduce you guys to nicer people, but they just don't commit as many murders.61400:39:01,000 --> 00:39:02,000Yeah.61500:39:02,000 --> 00:39:04,560Weird how that happens.61600:39:04,560 --> 00:39:14,440In May 31st, 2009, at the Evangelical Lutheran Church in Wichita, Dr. Tiller was assassinated61700:39:14,440 --> 00:39:16,360by Scott Roder.61800:39:16,360 --> 00:39:23,920He was shot in the head as he was performing service as an usher, just like any other Sunday.61900:39:23,920 --> 00:39:24,920What?62000:39:24,920 --> 00:39:34,520So this poor man was literally at church working for the church and was killed.62100:39:34,520 --> 00:39:36,920By someone in a church.62200:39:36,920 --> 00:39:37,920Wow.62300:39:37,920 --> 00:39:40,120By someone motivated.62400:39:40,120 --> 00:39:45,080By someone who claimed to be religious themselves.62500:39:45,080 --> 00:39:50,520Claimed to do this as a calling from God.62600:39:50,520 --> 00:39:54,440Like what if fucking slap in the face to God if you believe in him?62700:39:54,440 --> 00:39:55,840Like, geez.62800:39:55,840 --> 00:39:56,840Mm-hmm.62900:39:56,840 --> 00:40:01,400Scott Roder showed no remorse.63000:40:01,400 --> 00:40:05,920In his case, the jury was equally decisive.63100:40:05,920 --> 00:40:10,400He was convicted, then sentenced to life in prison.63200:40:10,400 --> 00:40:15,960He will not be eligible for parole until he has served 25 years.63300:40:15,960 --> 00:40:26,320Shelly was released in 2018 after serving 25 of the 31 years to which she was sentenced.63400:40:26,320 --> 00:40:27,320Not enough.63500:40:27,320 --> 00:40:28,320No.63600:40:28,320 --> 00:40:34,640Though she was released with the stipulation of a three-year monitored release, she has63700:40:34,640 --> 00:40:39,520continued to show no remorse for her actions.63800:40:39,520 --> 00:40:46,760She has also reportedly kept in touch with army of God members and other extremists through63900:40:46,760 --> 00:40:49,600both of her sentences.64000:40:49,600 --> 00:40:57,240The American Jewish Congress stated in a press release that Tiller's murder, quote,64100:40:57,240 --> 00:41:03,760"Exemplifies criminal andarchy, not legitimate protest."64200:41:03,760 --> 00:41:10,000Dr. Tiller's murder was not just a terrible crime against an individual.64300:41:10,000 --> 00:41:14,080It was also a crime against our democracy.64400:41:14,080 --> 00:41:17,640Murder is not a debating technique.64500:41:17,640 --> 00:41:25,800It is never and must never be an accepted way of advancing a point of view.64600:41:25,800 --> 00:41:32,520The president of the National Council of Jewish Women, Nancy Ratzin, stated,64700:41:32,520 --> 00:41:40,320"Dr. Tiller devoted his life to ensuring that women did indeed have choices, when confronted64800:41:40,320 --> 00:41:46,280with an unintended or untenable pregnancy.64900:41:46,280 --> 00:41:54,640His murder, his assassination, is intended to terrorize not only all involved with providing65000:41:54,640 --> 00:42:01,160abortions, but anyone even remotely associated with abortion rights."65100:42:01,160 --> 00:42:03,320It's really scary.65200:42:03,320 --> 00:42:12,920Years later, clinic staff that have relocated and begun working elsewhere have continued65300:42:12,920 --> 00:42:22,320to be harassed because they are known to have worked with Dr. Tiller and people that are65400:42:22,320 --> 00:42:28,360members of Army of God or other anti-abortion groups.65500:42:28,360 --> 00:42:30,360Track them down.65600:42:30,360 --> 00:42:35,080Like how do you think that that's going to get people on your side?65700:42:35,080 --> 00:42:42,400You can't possibly believe that that is a means to any reasonable end.65800:42:42,400 --> 00:42:44,400And yet, somehow they do.65900:42:44,400 --> 00:42:51,200I'm going to tell you the year that this article was published.66000:42:51,200 --> 00:43:00,560In August of this year, a 20-year-old man ostensibly seeking a job at a Kansas abortion clinic66100:43:00,560 --> 00:43:10,120was arrested after he told clinic staff his backpack contained an explosive device and knives,66200:43:10,120 --> 00:43:12,920according to Wichita Police.66300:43:12,920 --> 00:43:16,080Wow, 2015.66400:43:16,080 --> 00:43:24,840The explosive device was several fireworks that the suspect put together, according to authorities.66500:43:24,840 --> 00:43:31,280The incident occurred at South Wind Women's Center, which is in the same facility that Tiller66600:43:31,280 --> 00:43:34,480once occupied.66700:43:34,480 --> 00:43:42,800Julie Berkhardt, who used to work for Tiller, now runs a foundation that opened South Wind.66800:43:42,800 --> 00:43:49,560In August, she spoke about how his killing prompted the clinic to increase security.66900:43:49,560 --> 00:43:55,160She also spoke of the fear she lives with and said the August incident could have been much67000:43:55,160 --> 00:44:00,040worse than a man with some fireworks.67100:44:00,040 --> 00:44:07,480She said, quote, "I'm very concerned that someone would come in the building with weapons.67200:44:07,480 --> 00:44:10,920He was carrying knives and explosives.67300:44:10,920 --> 00:44:17,640This really illustrates to me that the security protocols that we have in place work."67400:44:17,640 --> 00:44:19,720Thank goodness.67500:44:19,720 --> 00:44:22,440So they caught him at the security?67600:44:22,440 --> 00:44:25,800Or yes, security identified that.67700:44:25,800 --> 00:44:32,520And on the flip side, a little bit of commentary from well the flip side.67800:44:32,520 --> 00:44:37,240The Reverend Donald Spitz, real name.67900:44:37,240 --> 00:44:42,400An anti-abortion activist who stayed in contact with Shannon.68000:44:42,400 --> 00:44:50,120Shelly Shannon said abortion rights activists should not be worried about Shannon's release.68100:44:50,120 --> 00:44:53,160I don't think she'll be doing anything violent.68200:44:53,160 --> 00:44:55,160Okay.68300:44:55,160 --> 00:45:02,760He is the leader of pro-life Virginia and sponsor of the Army of God website.68400:45:02,760 --> 00:45:08,200He said, "Of course, no one knows, but I'd be very surprised."68500:45:08,200 --> 00:45:10,040I do not trust his opinion.68600:45:10,040 --> 00:45:11,040Nope.68700:45:11,040 --> 00:45:12,040Don't worry.68800:45:12,040 --> 00:45:13,040She's fine.68900:45:13,040 --> 00:45:14,040She's fine.69000:45:14,040 --> 00:45:15,040She's not going to do anything.69100:45:15,040 --> 00:45:16,040No.69200:45:16,040 --> 00:45:22,360She probably won't do anything because she's already published her manifesto for violence.69300:45:22,360 --> 00:45:23,360She's doing.69400:45:23,360 --> 00:45:25,360Yeah.69500:45:25,360 --> 00:45:32,160He said he talked to Shannon and described her as upbeat about her release, but said he69600:45:32,160 --> 00:45:34,840didn't know Shannon's plans.69700:45:34,840 --> 00:45:38,960I'm sure she was upbeat about her release, but I don't believe for a second that you don't69800:45:38,960 --> 00:45:41,000know her plans.69900:45:41,000 --> 00:45:42,000Yeah.70000:45:42,000 --> 00:45:46,160Why are you talking then?70100:45:46,160 --> 00:45:51,000How can you be so sure that she's not going to be doing anything violent, but also you70200:45:51,000 --> 00:45:53,240don't know what any of her plans are?70300:45:53,240 --> 00:45:55,360And why are you talking about plans?70400:45:55,360 --> 00:46:00,120Like, if you're saying the word plans, it makes me think there's a plan.70500:46:00,120 --> 00:46:03,120You know, stands to reason.70600:46:03,120 --> 00:46:04,120Yeah.70700:46:04,120 --> 00:46:07,440Because normally, if it was me visiting you in prison and you were getting out, I would be70800:46:07,440 --> 00:46:11,840so Caitlin, what are your plans for like getting a job?70900:46:11,840 --> 00:46:14,320Like, where are you going to live?71000:46:14,320 --> 00:46:19,000You would know her plans in that regard, but you just don't know any plans.71100:46:19,000 --> 00:46:21,560You don't know anything about any plans.71200:46:21,560 --> 00:46:22,560Okay.71300:46:22,560 --> 00:46:25,320Sounds super believable.71400:46:25,320 --> 00:46:30,120And not at all anything to be concerned about.71500:46:30,120 --> 00:46:37,480Obviously, there's been a little bit of time that has passed and doesn't seem like there71600:46:37,480 --> 00:46:44,640has been anything violent that has occurred at least at Shelley's hands.71700:46:44,640 --> 00:46:53,760But you know, Shelley really doesn't have to create any of the chaos or violence with her71800:46:53,760 --> 00:46:58,080own hands anymore.71900:46:58,080 --> 00:47:05,920If you visit justice.gov, I've included the specific link in our pace bin.72000:47:05,920 --> 00:47:16,240Hopefully, it'll actually allow me to publish it where there are numerous recent violent72100:47:16,240 --> 00:47:27,280encounters that are summarized cases of violence and other various types of attacks, whether,72200:47:27,280 --> 00:47:35,560you know, verbal, whatever that may be against reproductive healthcare providers and their72300:47:35,560 --> 00:47:37,560staff.72400:47:37,560 --> 00:47:38,560Don't worry.72500:47:38,560 --> 00:47:41,760Right up at the top, there are several from 2023.72600:47:41,760 --> 00:47:44,560No, I don't want any.72700:47:44,560 --> 00:47:45,560Yeah.72800:47:45,560 --> 00:47:54,200I'm sure again, you don't have to agree that they are fighting a senseless battle at all.72900:47:54,200 --> 00:48:05,720I know there are plenty of people that don't agree, but surely most people can understand.73000:48:05,720 --> 00:48:18,320They can see that multiple assassination attempts and one of which, not an attempt, this was successful.73100:48:18,320 --> 00:48:24,120He was murdered in a goddamn church.73200:48:24,120 --> 00:48:26,960Surely we can agree that that is wrong.73300:48:26,960 --> 00:48:32,000Just like any violence is why you don't need to do that.73400:48:32,000 --> 00:48:37,680I just, there are official ways that you can go about getting your laws and whatever the73500:48:37,680 --> 00:48:40,840fuck you want, voted on.73600:48:40,840 --> 00:48:43,240Like you said, it's like a threat to democracy.73700:48:43,240 --> 00:48:44,840It really is.73800:48:44,840 --> 00:48:52,840One of the most upsetting things about researching this was realizing how people that were involved73900:48:52,840 --> 00:49:04,880in these protests and specifically a lot of the non-violent tactics that were utilized.74000:49:04,880 --> 00:49:13,840It was things like shutting down the freeways or they used a lot of non-violent tactics that74100:49:13,840 --> 00:49:18,560Black Lives Matter protest they've been condemned for.74200:49:18,560 --> 00:49:20,520Yeah, well of course.74300:49:20,520 --> 00:49:21,520Yeah.74400:49:21,520 --> 00:49:26,880The completely other thing that they're fighting for that they don't agree with.74500:49:26,880 --> 00:49:27,880Right.74600:49:27,880 --> 00:49:30,160That's irrational.74700:49:30,160 --> 00:49:34,480When I realized that I was like, and it goes back further than that.74800:49:34,480 --> 00:49:41,440It wasn't the Karen's outside plan parenthood that thought of the sitting in the middle of74900:49:41,440 --> 00:49:48,360the freeway or all of these various non-violent protest strategies.75000:49:48,360 --> 00:49:51,200It goes back to the civil rights movement.75100:49:51,200 --> 00:49:52,200Yeah.75200:49:52,200 --> 00:50:01,520But it was so interesting to me to think about how different the languages in those conversations.75300:50:01,520 --> 00:50:07,760The headline is that everyone fucking sucks.75400:50:07,760 --> 00:50:08,760Not everyone.75500:50:08,760 --> 00:50:10,760A lot of people.75600:50:10,760 --> 00:50:11,760A lot of people.75700:50:11,760 --> 00:50:12,760Yeah.75800:50:12,760 --> 00:50:13,760I don't know Cassie.75900:50:13,760 --> 00:50:14,760Not everyone sucks.76000:50:14,760 --> 00:50:17,480But a lot of people do.76100:50:17,480 --> 00:50:19,280You know what doesn't suck?76200:50:19,280 --> 00:50:20,280What?76300:50:20,280 --> 00:50:24,120Well, tarot doesn't suck to us.76400:50:24,120 --> 00:50:26,640My God.76500:50:26,640 --> 00:50:29,800Nobody better write us an email saying tarot sucks.76600:50:29,800 --> 00:50:33,520If it sucks, you know, there's an off button.76700:50:33,520 --> 00:50:34,520Yeah.76800:50:34,520 --> 00:50:37,360So suck it and you suck it.76900:50:37,360 --> 00:50:40,800And if you're pushing the off button, that means you push the on button, which means you77000:50:40,800 --> 00:50:41,800gave us a download.77100:50:41,800 --> 00:50:42,800Thank you.77200:50:42,800 --> 00:50:44,640Thank you.77300:50:44,640 --> 00:50:49,320So we also are going to have a little Patreon bonus to accompany this episode because77400:50:49,320 --> 00:50:53,920something really frickin bizarre happened to us last night.77500:50:53,920 --> 00:50:55,160Yeah.77600:50:55,160 --> 00:51:00,760So I was texting Caitlin about this topic I was working on and it was a topic that you're77700:51:00,760 --> 00:51:02,480not supposed to talk about.77800:51:02,480 --> 00:51:03,680It's not the main one.77900:51:03,680 --> 00:51:05,240Everyone knows it's a different one.78000:51:05,240 --> 00:51:06,240Imagine that.78100:51:06,240 --> 00:51:07,240Yeah.78200:51:07,240 --> 00:51:10,880So I texted her and I was like, "Haha, I'm working on this topic that you're not supposed78300:51:10,880 --> 00:51:11,880to talk about.78400:51:11,880 --> 00:51:15,280Hope I don't have any technological problems."78500:51:15,280 --> 00:51:19,080And like three minutes later.78600:51:19,080 --> 00:51:24,800It just crashes and is like, you know, the error message.78700:51:24,800 --> 00:51:28,200Honestly, it's unreal.78800:51:28,200 --> 00:51:30,280And then it happens again.78900:51:30,280 --> 00:51:34,280Every time I try to copy and paste and I was trying to copy and paste someone's comment79000:51:34,280 --> 00:51:38,440saying it's like a warning that this is real.79100:51:38,440 --> 00:51:44,520Almost like you couldn't drill into that head with a bit.79200:51:44,520 --> 00:51:47,720So if this wasn't enough, I...79300:51:47,720 --> 00:51:50,720So I screen-shoted that to Caitlin and sent it to her.79400:51:50,720 --> 00:51:57,280And then she sees this little tiny comment that someone had made that had absolutely nothing79500:51:57,280 --> 00:52:01,200to do with what I was talking about, like totally nothing to do with it.79600:52:01,200 --> 00:52:04,160And she just assumed like that was my topic, right?79700:52:04,160 --> 00:52:05,160Mm-hmm.79800:52:05,160 --> 00:52:06,160Yeah.79900:52:06,160 --> 00:52:08,400And so she Googles it and she's like, "Are you fucking kidding me?80000:52:08,400 --> 00:52:11,400This is a fertility god."80100:52:11,400 --> 00:52:15,520And I am working on this story that's, you know, kind of about fertility.80200:52:15,520 --> 00:52:16,520And...80300:52:16,520 --> 00:52:17,520Yeah.80400:52:17,520 --> 00:52:22,320So I was like, "Okay, is this a sign that I need to just drop this other topic for now and80500:52:22,320 --> 00:52:24,840just research this fertility god?"80600:52:24,840 --> 00:52:25,840Yeah.80700:52:25,840 --> 00:52:29,680A little and do a little bonus on it for Patreon.80800:52:29,680 --> 00:52:30,680So that's what I did.80900:52:30,680 --> 00:52:34,920I dropped my entire episode and worked on a bonus.81000:52:34,920 --> 00:52:38,880Well, you know, as one does sometimes.81100:52:38,880 --> 00:52:43,320But it's really interesting what I found.81200:52:43,320 --> 00:52:44,320Oh, boy.81300:52:44,320 --> 00:52:45,320Yeah.81400:52:45,320 --> 00:52:47,320I have about, I think, two and a half pages.81500:52:47,320 --> 00:52:48,960Oh, boy.81600:52:48,960 --> 00:52:50,640It's really cool.81700:52:50,640 --> 00:52:55,280A lot of it really directly relates, I feel like, to Caitlin.81800:52:55,280 --> 00:52:58,920So, uh, gray in a really good way, not bad.81900:52:58,920 --> 00:52:59,920Oh, okay.82000:52:59,920 --> 00:53:04,920Well, that whole thing was positive because you were kind of questioning your topic.82100:53:04,920 --> 00:53:08,240And I think that was just a sign like that you were doing the right thing.82200:53:08,240 --> 00:53:09,240Yeah.82300:53:09,240 --> 00:53:10,240I was.82400:53:10,240 --> 00:53:15,240I feel like this was a really tough one just because I know that abortion specifically82500:53:15,240 --> 00:53:22,680is a very controversial topic, but we're not really talking about abortion.82600:53:22,680 --> 00:53:24,080I mean, I did.82700:53:24,080 --> 00:53:25,880And I have a lot of thoughts and feelings.82800:53:25,880 --> 00:53:30,080And I did my best to reign the moon.82900:53:30,080 --> 00:53:36,520But, um, you know, this is about something far more significant than that.83000:53:36,520 --> 00:53:41,880It's just, you know, violence that doesn't have anything to do with, you know, what's83100:53:41,880 --> 00:53:44,520now become a political talking point.83200:53:44,520 --> 00:53:45,520Yeah.83300:53:45,520 --> 00:53:48,240You're an arsonist.83400:53:48,240 --> 00:53:53,440You're an attempted murder, arrests or an actual murderer.83500:53:53,440 --> 00:53:54,440Yeah.83600:53:54,440 --> 00:53:58,440I just got like this thing in my head, like murder to protest murder.83700:53:58,440 --> 00:53:59,440Yeah.83800:53:59,440 --> 00:54:01,400How does that make sense?83900:54:01,400 --> 00:54:02,600Make it make sense.84000:54:02,600 --> 00:54:06,080I don't think it's murder personally, but like coming from their standpoint.84100:54:06,080 --> 00:54:11,840But if you believe that it's murder and act like it's murder, yeah.84200:54:11,840 --> 00:54:16,640I just, I, yeah, just going to use their own goddamn slogan against them.84300:54:16,640 --> 00:54:20,880Anyway, so Patreon's going to get a really cool bonus.84400:54:20,880 --> 00:54:22,480And I think Caitlin's going to love it.84500:54:22,480 --> 00:54:24,320I'm excited to tell her about it.84600:54:24,320 --> 00:54:25,320Yeah.84700:54:25,320 --> 00:54:26,720Yay.84800:54:26,720 --> 00:54:35,040As indie podcasters, we love to show our support of other awesome shows.84900:54:35,040 --> 00:54:38,920So stay tuned for the promo we've got to share with you this week.85000:54:38,920 --> 00:54:43,400Let's show them some love you can find their info in our show notes.85100:54:43,400 --> 00:54:47,840Hey creepy people.85200:54:47,840 --> 00:54:53,440It's Gemma from I think my fridge is haunted, a very creepy podcast for very creepy people.85300:54:53,440 --> 00:54:59,560We tell all kinds of weird stories from the paranormal to aliens, true crime and history.85400:54:59,560 --> 00:55:03,520But what makes us different from all those other podcasts talking about this stuff?85500:55:03,520 --> 00:55:05,280Well, that's a good question.85600:55:05,280 --> 00:55:06,600And the answer is simple.85700:55:06,600 --> 00:55:08,880We have Australian accents.85800:55:08,880 --> 00:55:14,960Join me in my secret new co-host as we launch season six this August on Apple podcasts,85900:55:14,960 --> 00:55:19,600Spotify, Podbean and all good podcast platforms.86000:55:19,600 --> 00:55:21,840Until then, be creepy.86100:55:21,840 --> 00:55:25,360But don't be a creep.86200:55:25,360 --> 00:55:27,720You guys were back.86300:55:27,720 --> 00:55:30,320And don't worry, we did get more wine.86400:55:30,320 --> 00:55:34,760Well, of course.86500:55:34,760 --> 00:55:36,960I have shuffled.86600:55:36,960 --> 00:55:37,960I'm going to do it.86700:55:37,960 --> 00:55:42,960And then I can't let's go to shuffle and pull.86800:55:42,960 --> 00:55:44,960What was that?86900:55:44,960 --> 00:55:45,960Wow.87000:55:45,960 --> 00:55:49,520You guys, I've been having a lot of problems with my hands.87100:55:49,520 --> 00:55:52,120I cut my ring finger.87200:55:52,120 --> 00:55:54,120You can't really see that with the light.87300:55:54,120 --> 00:55:56,120It's like mini cards.87400:55:56,120 --> 00:55:58,800Oh, Caitlin.87500:55:58,800 --> 00:56:00,280I can't reach any of them.87600:56:00,280 --> 00:56:04,280Struggle bus, passenger number one.87700:56:04,280 --> 00:56:07,520If it wasn't 20 cards that fell away, could he use that?87800:56:07,520 --> 00:56:08,520I know.87900:56:08,520 --> 00:56:09,520Yeah.88000:56:09,520 --> 00:56:12,960Well, I feel like there's chaotic energy in here.88100:56:12,960 --> 00:56:17,280I was trying to cleanse it.88200:56:17,280 --> 00:56:19,120Okay, there we go.88300:56:19,120 --> 00:56:20,960We're feeling a little better.88400:56:20,960 --> 00:56:26,200We also just came off of an interview with some creepy, creepy haps.88500:56:26,200 --> 00:56:27,800Oh, interesting.88600:56:27,800 --> 00:56:30,000The star.88700:56:30,000 --> 00:56:31,880It's a very positive card.88800:56:31,880 --> 00:56:36,000It is, which seems a little odd, but I'm going to roll with it.88900:56:36,000 --> 00:56:40,720I love getting positive cards after a truly horrific story.89000:56:40,720 --> 00:56:43,840I feel like this was the doctor.89100:56:43,840 --> 00:56:46,640I should look up what kind of bird that is.89200:56:46,640 --> 00:56:47,640Yes.89300:56:47,640 --> 00:56:48,640Do that.89400:56:48,640 --> 00:56:49,640Okay.89500:56:49,640 --> 00:56:59,320Keywords are happiness, hope, light at the end of the tunnel and good fortune.89600:56:59,320 --> 00:57:06,680This lovely card often portrays a nude female figure in or beside a pool of water.89700:57:06,680 --> 00:57:12,920In some decks, she pours water from two jugs or chalices.89800:57:12,920 --> 00:57:19,280In the writer wait Smith deck, she pours the contents of one picture into a stream and89900:57:19,280 --> 00:57:26,560the other one onto the ground, showing the connection between two feminine elements,90000:57:26,560 --> 00:57:28,400water and earth.90100:57:28,400 --> 00:57:34,560They are shine in the background, sometimes in a circle or a halo-like formation around90200:57:34,560 --> 00:57:35,720her.90300:57:35,720 --> 00:57:39,320The naked woman represents truth and purity.90400:57:39,320 --> 00:57:42,160The jugs contain the waters of life.90500:57:42,160 --> 00:57:46,160Yeah, it's a very feminine card from what I remember.90600:57:46,160 --> 00:57:47,160We've read it a lot.90700:57:47,160 --> 00:57:48,160Wow.90800:57:48,160 --> 00:57:50,720And I've read it very recently.90900:57:50,720 --> 00:57:55,200We see shooting stars as Harp and Jersey of Good Luck.91000:57:55,200 --> 00:58:00,640We wish upon a star for the star is a universal symbol of hope.91100:58:00,640 --> 00:58:07,120Getting this card is like looking up at the bright starry sky on a clear night and seeing91200:58:07,120 --> 00:58:10,720all the magnificence of the universe.91300:58:10,720 --> 00:58:18,160This is a time of fulfillment, good fortune, creative inspiration and spiritual growth.91400:58:18,160 --> 00:58:24,040When you receive help from unseen forces and wishes come true.91500:58:24,040 --> 00:58:30,120The star signals an end to problems and the start of a new, happier phase of life.91600:58:30,120 --> 00:58:32,960I fucking hope so.91700:58:32,960 --> 00:58:36,680I think of it as the light at the end of the tunnel card.91800:58:36,680 --> 00:58:39,720Oh my god.91900:58:39,720 --> 00:58:43,920Like people who have had a near death experience and they see the light.92000:58:43,920 --> 00:58:46,320Or people that have been through a lot of shit.92100:58:46,320 --> 00:58:47,320Yeah.92200:58:47,320 --> 00:58:53,760Well, it's just interesting to me too because it talks about pouring the contents of one92300:58:53,760 --> 00:58:57,360picture into a stream and the other one onto the ground.92400:58:57,360 --> 00:59:04,480And immediately I had this flash of like that old saying throwing the baby out with the92500:59:04,480 --> 00:59:07,440bath water.92600:59:07,440 --> 00:59:12,560Which seems weird.92700:59:12,560 --> 00:59:22,840But I think there's, it just sort of speaks to, there's a way of handling disagreements.92800:59:22,840 --> 00:59:29,920I think, you know, kind of some of those quotations from the Jewish women leagues.92900:59:29,920 --> 00:59:31,320They really summarized.93000:59:31,320 --> 00:59:37,160I think probably what a lot of us would wish to say so eloquently.93100:59:37,160 --> 00:59:38,160Yeah.93200:59:38,160 --> 00:59:42,200You've been preparing for this time and now you've arrived.93300:59:42,200 --> 00:59:49,560The star shows you're in harmony with your life purpose using your gifts beneficially.93400:59:49,560 --> 00:59:57,480It signifies inspiration, intuition, inner wisdom, and joy.93500:59:57,480 --> 01:00:04,520In a reading about money, the star signals an improvement in your financial position.93601:00:04,520 --> 01:00:09,320Help comes from both the invisible world and the material one.93701:00:09,320 --> 01:00:10,320Remain hopeful.93801:00:10,320 --> 01:00:12,560Your dreams can be achieved.93901:00:12,560 --> 01:00:17,400If the reading is about your job, you may be moving into the spotlight.94001:00:17,400 --> 01:00:23,320Being recognition for your efforts, you're the star, and it's your turn to shine.94101:00:23,320 --> 01:00:29,000You feel good about yourself and confident in your place in the universe.94201:00:29,000 --> 01:00:32,440Success lies just around the corner.94301:00:32,440 --> 01:00:38,440In a reading about love, this card represents a bright, beautiful relationship that inspires94401:00:38,440 --> 01:00:40,840you and brings you joy.94501:00:40,840 --> 01:00:45,240The wish you made has or will soon come true.94601:00:45,240 --> 01:00:46,240Wow.94701:00:46,240 --> 01:00:49,840I just think it's an overall positive card.94801:00:49,840 --> 01:00:50,840It is.94901:00:50,840 --> 01:00:53,080You can't let the evil people win.95001:00:53,080 --> 01:00:54,080No.95101:00:54,080 --> 01:00:55,080Just keep trucking on.95201:00:55,080 --> 01:00:56,080Yeah.95301:00:56,080 --> 01:00:58,080Things will get better, hopefully.95401:00:58,080 --> 01:01:04,480Even though it's still happening in 2023.95501:01:04,480 --> 01:01:08,960Well, it's a morning dove.95601:01:08,960 --> 01:01:10,560A morning dove.95701:01:10,560 --> 01:01:16,200Interesting because you know, morning MOUR and it is spelled morning.95801:01:16,200 --> 01:01:17,200In that.95901:01:17,200 --> 01:01:18,200Wow.96001:01:18,200 --> 01:01:19,200Yeah.96101:01:19,200 --> 01:01:20,200Okay.96201:01:20,200 --> 01:01:24,600So that's interesting that I immediately just like, you're strong into it.96301:01:24,600 --> 01:01:29,120Like Doctor the God assassinated or like anyone else who lost their life or went through96401:01:29,120 --> 01:01:33,440a lot of pain because of these horrible people.96501:01:33,440 --> 01:01:34,440Wow.96601:01:34,440 --> 01:01:35,440Yeah.96701:01:35,440 --> 01:01:36,440Yeah.96801:01:36,440 --> 01:01:38,040Just should I read this?96901:01:38,040 --> 01:01:39,040Yeah.97001:01:39,040 --> 01:01:40,040Why not?97101:01:40,040 --> 01:01:41,040I'll try.97201:01:41,040 --> 01:01:42,040Okay.97301:01:42,040 --> 01:01:54,040I'm sorry.97401:01:54,040 --> 01:01:56,040I said that right.97501:01:56,040 --> 01:01:57,040You do.97601:01:57,040 --> 01:02:01,640Filled with trepidation and fear, he flew towards the bright beacon above the horizon.97701:02:01,640 --> 01:02:07,120Doves wings kept him aloft in the daylight through forest, valley and wasteland, heading97801:02:07,120 --> 01:02:11,480ever toward the morning star, still shining in the distance.97901:02:11,480 --> 01:02:17,480His dove journeyed, his heart lightened and felt echoes of past pilgrims.98001:02:17,480 --> 01:02:22,560His path intertwined with those of other travelers.98101:02:22,560 --> 01:02:24,360He left his fear behind.98201:02:24,360 --> 01:02:30,480He wheeled joyously in the sky and skimmed above the clouds, flying higher than he had any98301:02:30,480 --> 01:02:32,360right to.98401:02:32,360 --> 01:02:36,080He tested the boundaries of himself and the world he inhabited.98501:02:36,080 --> 01:02:37,080Wow.98601:02:37,080 --> 01:02:38,080That's interesting.98701:02:38,080 --> 01:02:39,080Yeah.98801:02:39,080 --> 01:02:42,600He tested the boundaries of the world he inhabited.98901:02:42,600 --> 01:02:43,600Okay.99001:02:43,600 --> 01:02:50,400A part of him hoped that he'd never reached that star, not wanting to journey to the end.99101:02:50,400 --> 01:02:54,600The rest of him wondered what would happen if he got there.99201:02:54,600 --> 01:03:06,120I'm wondering if you remember this fact about him, which was that he was a flight surgeon.99301:03:06,120 --> 01:03:07,120Really?99401:03:07,120 --> 01:03:08,120Wow.99501:03:08,120 --> 01:03:10,720I did not know that.99601:03:10,720 --> 01:03:11,720Yeah.99701:03:11,720 --> 01:03:12,960That's crazy.99801:03:12,960 --> 01:03:14,960I was right.99901:03:14,960 --> 01:03:17,280I mean, very representative.100001:03:17,280 --> 01:03:20,520I mean, the symbolism seems...100101:03:20,520 --> 01:03:21,760Wow.100201:03:21,760 --> 01:03:22,760Maybe I'm crazy, but...100301:03:22,760 --> 01:03:24,560No, I don't seem too pretty clear.100401:03:24,560 --> 01:03:25,560You're crazy.100501:03:25,560 --> 01:03:27,560What number is this?100601:03:27,560 --> 01:03:28,56017.100701:03:28,560 --> 01:03:29,560Yes.100801:03:29,560 --> 01:03:33,320I don't know if that has any significance?100901:03:33,320 --> 01:03:39,840I can't think of anything specific that resonates with that, but...101001:03:39,840 --> 01:03:40,840I'm going to check.101101:03:40,840 --> 01:03:42,240That was just really cool.101201:03:42,240 --> 01:03:43,840That was a good one.101301:03:43,840 --> 01:03:44,840That was what I wanted.101401:03:44,840 --> 01:03:47,080That was the energy I put into the car.101501:03:47,080 --> 01:03:48,080Yeah.101601:03:48,080 --> 01:03:49,080I mean, that was...101701:03:49,080 --> 01:03:54,760It felt more positive than that story felt like it had a right to.101801:03:54,760 --> 01:03:55,760Yeah.101901:03:55,760 --> 01:03:57,600So, they just can't win.102001:03:57,600 --> 01:03:58,600They can't do it.102101:03:58,600 --> 01:03:59,600No.102201:03:59,600 --> 01:04:00,600We have to be positive.102301:04:00,600 --> 01:04:01,600Okay.102401:04:01,600 --> 01:04:03,400Creepy ass day.102501:04:03,400 --> 01:04:13,400[Music]102601:04:13,400 --> 01:04:39,080[Music]102701:04:39,080 --> 01:04:43,400He wheeled jealousy in the sky and skimmed above the clouds.102801:04:43,400 --> 01:04:44,400I'm sorry.102901:04:44,400 --> 01:04:45,400I read that wrong again.103001:04:45,400 --> 01:04:46,400He wheeled jealousy.103101:04:46,400 --> 01:04:47,400Joyously?103201:04:47,400 --> 01:04:48,400Yeah.103301:04:48,400 --> 01:04:49,400What are kissing jealous?103401:04:49,400 --> 01:04:50,400I don't know.103501:04:50,400 --> 01:04:51,400Okay.103601:04:51,400 --> 01:04:52,400Re-do.103701:04:52,400 --> 01:04:53,400Cause you wish you could fly.103801:04:53,400 --> 01:04:54,400I know.103901:04:54,400 --> 01:04:55,400It's true.104001:04:55,400 --> 01:04:56,400Yeah.104101:04:56,400 --> 01:04:57,400Yeah.104201:04:57,400 --> 01:05:07,400[Music] pnwhauntsandhomicides.com